ScottM
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iBazinga!
Tim FTW! LOL!!!
Advice, please -- Whom Shall We Sue? (Non-Av)
- Thread starter Jay Honeck
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Let's say Expedia MAY take the risk.
As the hotel has to wait for the cheque from Expedia (probably offset by the marketing fees for the other non-pre-pay reservations), there is a chance that they would say 'tough luck', we didn't get paid and so do you in case of a charge reversal on a no-show reservation.
You guys just don't get it..................................................
Jay and Mary informed Expedia of the bad card, and they then billed Amelia's Landing for a 15% commision for their "service"......
For Jesse...... If I call up to book a flight with the company you work for and give a CC number,,, you run that # and it comes up good at that time... I then send a third party to take that ride.. You give the flight and then run the card ... it now comes up stolen and you are out the cash... Are you gonna say you will just eat it and write it off as a life experience ???
..I say BS................. You will be on here crying like a 1 year old baby with wet diapers.... IMHO.
And it would be entirely different if you actually OWNED the company instead of just being an employee....
Cap'n Jack
Final Approach
It probably depends, in part, on when the on-line reservation was made. If the credit card come back as bad before the reservation date, I'd hope Expedia would cancel the reservation.
I do realize I'm guessing, as most of us are. I also note we're hearing one side of the story and I also note none of us, except, possibly for Jay, know the contract terms between Jay and Expedia (or the company he used to work with Expedia- I seem to remember another player involved?)
It seems to me that this all comes down to a case of RTFM.
Cap'n Jack
Final Approach
I agree with that!
ScottM
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iBazinga!
Even if Expedia ran the card# and it come up good and we know Jay ran the card# and it also came up good. If it was reported as lost or stolen the card company would not tell them. When the guy checks in and physical card is swept would be when it was caught. But that did not happen because the guy and the card never showed up. So Jay only could re-run the # he had.
I had my card# stolen recently and they ran a several hundred dollar charge for a Eurorail ticket. I disputed and won. Because Eruorail never had the real card they could not win the case. Jay is in the same boat here and it appears from what was written in a much earlier post is that Jay will lose if he goes to arbitration with the card company. His only hope it would seem is to find out if Expedia did indeed run the card and then try to convince them to eat it.
The one question I don't think has been asked nor do I think Jay has given info on is, did these fake reservation prevent the rooms from being used? IOW were other customers turned away because of the reservation?
I had my card# stolen recently and they ran a several hundred dollar charge for a Eurorail ticket. I disputed and won. Because Eruorail never had the real card they could not win the case. Jay is in the same boat here and it appears from what was written in a much earlier post is that Jay will lose if he goes to arbitration with the card company. His only hope it would seem is to find out if Expedia did indeed run the card and then try to convince them to eat it.
The one question I don't think has been asked nor do I think Jay has given info on is, did these fake reservation prevent the rooms from being used? IOW were other customers turned away because of the reservation?
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TMetzinger
Final Approach
Note - I DON'T think Expedia is entitled to their fee.
But the dispute here appears (to me anyway) to be between the cardholder, who claims he never authorized the charge, and Jay, who billed his card, with the credit card company in the middle.
Now, I've made reservations that I've had to cancel after the "allowed" time, and in those cases I've seen the charge on my card and not had a problem with it.
Given the hassle that comes with claiming your card has been stolen - you get a new card number and have to change it everywhere you may have set up automatic billing or accounts - it can act as a deterrent to false claims of identity theft.
But the dispute here appears (to me anyway) to be between the cardholder, who claims he never authorized the charge, and Jay, who billed his card, with the credit card company in the middle.
Now, I've made reservations that I've had to cancel after the "allowed" time, and in those cases I've seen the charge on my card and not had a problem with it.
Given the hassle that comes with claiming your card has been stolen - you get a new card number and have to change it everywhere you may have set up automatic billing or accounts - it can act as a deterrent to false claims of identity theft.
The way I understood Jays posts he honored the reservations and held the rooms for that night.
Palmpilot
Touchdown! Greaser!
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Plenty of people with 10 different low-limit cards. Giving one up and claim 'stolen' to get out of a $500 obligation is nothing to those characters.
ScottM
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iBazinga!
I understand that But that was not my question. The question is were other potential customers turned away because he was holding them?
If they were not, the rooms would have been empty anyways and not generating any income that night. At this point the charge to Victor for the fraudulent rooms is really not worth the hassle and heartburn and really is not offsetting any sort of lose from holding the room.
Palmpilot
Touchdown! Greaser!
Hmmmm.....
How convenient is that ..
What's your point? Have I voiced too few opinions? Am I obligated to have an opinion on every aspect of this?
Jay Honeck
Touchdown! Greaser!
Wow -- that's actually pretty cool.
I'm always astounded by the number of guests who leave EVERYTHING on when they leave. Air conditioner set to 66 degrees, HDTV blaring, every light on. It's so wasteful -- but I can just imagine the number of complaints that would come with the "key in the wall" thingie.
As for the exposed wiring you found, we looked at a few properties on the island that were like that. I'm talking, "why-hasn't-this-place-burst-into-flames-yet" scary stuff.
Until pretty recently, there were few zoning or construction laws on the island, and it shows. Lots of substandard construction here -- but, of course, the attitude is "it's going to get blown to smithereens anyway -- so why put money into it"?
Jay Honeck
Touchdown! Greaser!
What choice did I have? If Expedia sent me the reservation, I have no choice to accept it as valid. I then went a step further, and preauthorized the card for the amount of the stay -- and it went through just fine.
If the end user followed the credit company's procedures, then yes.
Of course, this would eliminate all on-line business, since every credit company's procedure requires that the cardholder and the card be physically present.
Jay Honeck
Touchdown! Greaser!
Yup, we held the rooms open all night long, on a sold-out weekend, during our busiest month.
Jay Honeck
Touchdown! Greaser!
Jay Honeck
Touchdown! Greaser!
Oh, well -- this has (as always) been highly educational, and (mostly) fun to discuss. I thank you all for your input, and helping me through to a logical conclusion and solution.
Sometimes I get too wrapped up in what is "fair and proper", and forget the big picture. As Mary not-so-gently reminded me yesterday, (whilst we were working on repairing a broken pipe that had flooded three rooms) when I was about to pop a blood vessel over Expedia, our business was up an incredible 60% last month (September), year over year.
Apparently we're doing SOMETHING right -- so what the hell...
Sometimes I get too wrapped up in what is "fair and proper", and forget the big picture. As Mary not-so-gently reminded me yesterday, (whilst we were working on repairing a broken pipe that had flooded three rooms) when I was about to pop a blood vessel over Expedia, our business was up an incredible 60% last month (September), year over year.
Apparently we're doing SOMETHING right -- so what the hell...
Palmpilot
Touchdown! Greaser!
Did Expedia have any choice about whether to accept the card?
By the way, I think the credit card compay's $500 penalty per room if you lose your appeal is unfair, because there's no $500 penalty for the cardholder for losing.
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Ghery
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Ghery Pettit
I had a hotel in New Zealand where that card was needed just to keep the heat on in the room. Darned cold for a while until it warmed up. My wife got a second key just to defeat that "feature".
Eh?
Find the thread on ANN and the fun and games between the head honcho and Cirrus.
ScottM
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iBazinga!
That is not real new at all. I have been dealing with that for a lot of years. Granted almost always in overseas hotels. The annoying part in the tropics where it is hot. I am in south China right now, west of Hong Kong and north of Macua by a couple of mile. My room has that feature and when you take the card out of the slot it also turns the air/con off. So I ask for two keys so I can leave one in the key power slot and have the a/c running. That way when I get into the room it is not 85F and have to wait an hour for it to cool down.
wsuffa
Touchdown! Greaser!
Your AOPA card will work just fine. The IEEE card is too thin.
That's commonplace in parts of Europe, too, where the blower for the heat or AC is also tied into the key/card operated room master switch.
What this tells me is that the owners of these places don't actually understand how air conditioning works. Idiots.
wsuffa
Touchdown! Greaser!
Tell that to the folks that write the energy conservation laws (esp. in Europe).....
It really isn't as big of a deal as it sounds since the outside walls/windows are generally very well insulated.
Everskyward
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Everskyward
I've also been to places where you need to insert a card to turn on the electrical power in the room. I think it was in Mexico.
As far as leaving things running when the room is unoccupied, I know a lot of people who do that. On the other hand, many times I find the A/C running at full blast when I check into a room or after housekeeping has cleaned it. I guess when they are moving around they get hot but someone should tell them to turn it down later.
As far as leaving things running when the room is unoccupied, I know a lot of people who do that. On the other hand, many times I find the A/C running at full blast when I check into a room or after housekeeping has cleaned it. I guess when they are moving around they get hot but someone should tell them to turn it down later.
tonycondon
Gastons CRO (Chief Dinner Reservation Officer)
when I was in Llano we had the A/C running full blast all week, and especially when we weren't there. It was 100-105 every day and we'd leave at 9 AM and at least I and usually Leah would be out in the sun until 6 or 7 PM. I wanted that room ice cold when I got back!
wanttaja
En-Route
I was in Chicago about fifteen years ago, in a hotel near downtown (Sheraton, I think) and the deadbolt of the door had to be set for the air conditioning to work. Not in the room, no AC. Chicago was in a severe heat wave at the time, that room got HOT.
Find the thread on ANN and the fun and games between the head honcho and Cirrus.
Jay hasn't accused Expedia of terrorism yet, so we're safe so far...
Ron Wanttaja
I don't think it's to defraud Jay, I thinks it's an effort to defraud the entire industry. Double Billing is a common tactic with high volume merchants same as cash registers not reflecting advertised sale prices. They know only around 10% of them will be contested and for those they say "sorry, our bad, here's your money back" when they get called out on it.
Jay Honeck
Touchdown! Greaser!
That's SOP in hotels. If the room is occupied -- or we expect it to be occupied -- the A/C is always turned on high.
This is essential, given how long a heat-soaked room can take to cool down in the Gulf. Heck, it was still 89 degrees last night, at 8 PM.
The other rule is dark. You always want the curtains closed when a guest checks in. (I personally think that one is pretty stupid -- I like a bright look -- but these are rules that go back generations....)
Jay Honeck
Touchdown! Greaser!
Right you are!
On average, we find that 10% - 15% of the bills we receive from the on-line booking agencies are fraudulent or just plain wrong. Were it not for Mary's meticulous tracking and database skills, we would have paid out many thousands of dollars in bogus commissions last year.
These "errors" include billing for reservations who have cancelled, or (best of all) for reservations we've already paid them for.
Now, picture the average small motel owner in America. How many of them have the ability or time to do this sort of double checking? IMHO, it is deliberate "fraud-through-neglect" on the part of the on-line booking agencies, simply because they knowingly will not put out the effort to fix what everyone knows is a hopelessly inaccurate billing system.
p1l0t
Line Up and Wait
Greed.
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Everskyward
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Everskyward
I didn't know that. Personally I don't like the room to be very cold in contrast to the outside temperature and I almost always turn it down or off. Maybe part of the reason is that I don't have A/C in my own house and I'm used to it being warm in the summer. In any case it seems that in most hotels the temperature is somewhat regulated centrally and the room temperature controls are only a supplement. It also could be that the rooms are well insulated.
I haven't noticed one way or another about the dark. I also like the natural light except when the window opens to the parking lot.
Matthew
Touchdown! Greaser!
In my experience, hotel rooms have three thermostats: The one on the wall or on the front panel of the A/C, mine, and my wife's.
p1l0t
Line Up and Wait
LOL I remember someone telling me they replaced their old thermostat with a fake one (or just disconnected the wires or something) and setup a computerzed panel in the basement because his wife would always turn the heat way up or way down for no aparent reason. (Except maybe to turn it the opposite direction he just did..)
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jsstevens
And then the out of towner has a place to stay. Problem solved...
Yup.... Free lodging,, free food,. free medical,,, free legal,, congical visits... What else could a guy want.
p1l0t
Line Up and Wait
Yup.... Free lodging,, free food,. free medical,,, free legal,, congical visits... What else could a guy want.
Wow I need to commit more crime
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