100LL Debacle

Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by Dave Anderson, Aug 13, 2022.

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  1. GaryM

    GaryM Pattern Altitude

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    Yes, yes I would!

    Since no one has done the math in this thread (and feel free to check this), at 20 breaths a minute, or 28,800 a day, or 10,512,000 a year, one would inhale about 840,960,000 times in an 80 year lifespan.

    So 840,960,000 atoms of inhaled lead is a big scary number, right? Except Avagadro's number (6.023 x 10^23) is so very much bigger. At the rate of one atom per breath, one would inhale 0.000000000000001 mol of lead in a lifetime. 207.2 g/mol, so that works out to a lifetime exposure of 0.29 picograms (0.00000000029 mg).

    Figuring out the lifetime exposure to lead based on one atom per sip of water is left as an exercise for the reader. But it will also be a lot of atoms, with a total weight almost indistinguishable from zero.
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2022
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  2. asicer

    asicer Final Approach

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    The green stuff was before my time. For those that lived through it, how long did it take for us to transition from that to the blue stuff?
     
  3. FPK1

    FPK1 Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I certainly see no reason to waste tax payer money on EAGLE

    "EAGLE Initiative | Federal Aviation Administration"

    https://www.faa.gov/unleaded
     
  4. Pi1otguy

    Pi1otguy Pattern Altitude

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    And now the rental experience gets fun. Is your rental filled with 100LL (6lb/gal) or G100UL (6.3lb/gal)? Did the last guy mix 100LL and G100UL, or are you about to be an NTSB report?
     
  5. Palmpilot

    Palmpilot Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I think it's supposed to be OK to mix them.

    Whether mixing with UL94 has been tested, I don't know.
     
  6. MooneyDriver78

    MooneyDriver78 En-Route

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    Good question. But that didn’t require an STC did it?
     
  7. Morgan3820

    Morgan3820 En-Route

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    The FAA. They signed the STC.That doesn’t mean that you aren’t on the hook for actual damages.
     
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  8. Morgan3820

    Morgan3820 En-Route

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    Bubba has over a year to purchase the STC. Even then, nobody will ask. I expect that a bunch of the bubbas won’t make the purchase. Bubba pilots are notoriously cheap and grumpy and shortsighted. There are a lot of people that will complain about having to buy presliced bread. There are people that will go out of their way to find something negative about anything new, even if they have to create it. “I don’t like this new fuel injection crap, I like carburetors.”
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2022
  9. Morgan3820

    Morgan3820 En-Route

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    Listen to the AOPA interview and all of your questions will be answered.
     
  10. Bob Noel

    Bob Noel Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Don't forget that the body does not absorb every molecule inhaled (otherwise, mouth-to-mouth wouldn't work at all).
     
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  11. Morgan3820

    Morgan3820 En-Route

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    There is something of everything in everything.
     
  12. Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe

    Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Bubba's gona buy gas and go on his way.
     
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  13. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Did you watch the interview with George....and did you hear what he said? George "gives" them credit.....
     
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  14. Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe

    Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe Touchdown! Greaser!

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    If you turn in to an NTSB report, you did something besides mixing the fuel.

    They tested various mixes.

    Most of the questions in this thread were covered in the interview.

    And for fuel weight, are you sure that 100LL is only 6.0 pounds per gallon, or do we round off just a bit?
     
  15. Daleandee

    Daleandee En-Route

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  16. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Touchdown! Greaser!

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    So....there are no limitations?
     
  17. Pinecone

    Pinecone Cleared for Takeoff

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    I like ADSB.

    In flight weather. Traffic.
     
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  18. Pinecone

    Pinecone Cleared for Takeoff

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    He will fill up with it. And no one will care. Unless he is involved in a mishap and they check the fuel and ask for a copy of the STC. He may then find issues with his insurance coverage.

    I know when the MOGAS STCs came out, that many people did not buy the STC, but just ran MOGAS.
     
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  19. kaiser

    kaiser Cleared for Takeoff

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    I think Braly gave us a shout out at about 13:08.. listen carefully!
     
  20. Half Fast

    Half Fast Final Approach

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    Yep! Clearly George says there will be a substantial discount for POA members! :happydance:
     
  21. Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe

    Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe Touchdown! Greaser!

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    :goofy:
     
  22. Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe

    Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe Touchdown! Greaser!

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  23. Morgan3820

    Morgan3820 En-Route

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    Watch the AOPA interview!
     
  24. asicer

    asicer Final Approach

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    "this time next year" until we can start pumping it (3:15).
     
  25. Bob Noel

    Bob Noel Touchdown! Greaser!

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    yup - ADS-B could have been so useful... but suffers from the classic committe charlie-foxtrot screwups and empire building.
     
  26. Pinecone

    Pinecone Cleared for Takeoff

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    true, but what we have does give benefits.
     
  27. PaulMillner

    PaulMillner Line Up and Wait

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    One refinery was still making green 100/130 just five years ago... so over 30 years of transition.

    Paul
     
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  28. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Touchdown! Greaser!

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    I did…..
     
  29. Mxfarm

    Mxfarm Line Up and Wait

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    On paper, everything implements fast, but to actually make it happen, there are always hurdles. If there's not a good plan in place today that's already being implemented, we better hope 100LL is here for a bit.

    A lot pilots explain and talk about an IAP, flying them isnt the same.
     
  30. Shepherd

    Shepherd Final Approach

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    How much does the STC cost? I must have missed that detail.
    I can now buy 91 octane MOGAS for less than $5.00 a gallon.
    Why on earth would I spend almost $8.77 a gallon (locally) for G100UL to solve a completely non-existent lead issue?
     
  31. Dana

    Dana En-Route

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    You wouldn't. But a lot of people live in places where ethanol free mogas simply isn't available.
     
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  32. Checkout_my_Six

    Checkout_my_Six Touchdown! Greaser!

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    well then....you can save all your pennies and not buy it. The STC will cost something comparable to the Peterson STC.
     
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  33. Morgan3820

    Morgan3820 En-Route

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    No reason at all. But didn’t you just recently get a filling station that carry the ethanol free? What would you have done before?
     
  34. Pinecone

    Pinecone Cleared for Takeoff

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    Interesting. For what market?

    I know that someone was making a batch of Purple 115/145 for Reno each year.
     
  35. Pinecone

    Pinecone Cleared for Takeoff

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    GAMI supposedly has AVFUEL in place for distribution.

    As for making it, someone will have front the money to pay for it. And unless there is something difficult for a refinery in the process, if you order and pay for it, they will make it.
     
  36. MooneyDriver78

    MooneyDriver78 En-Route

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    Since it’s only paperwork, no actual changes required as I understand it (not even changing the timing?), I think if it’s more than $100 we’re getting screwed.
    They’ll make plenty of money off the royalties on the fuel.
     
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  37. donjohnston

    donjohnston Pattern Altitude

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    There are people other than you in the aviation world.
    And some of them (maybe most) can't run MOGAS.
     
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  38. Shepherd

    Shepherd Final Approach

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    My son-in-law offered to start bringing MOGAS down to me from farther upstate. Or just keep using 100LL. I'll run out of time before they run out of 100LL.
     
  39. Pi1otguy

    Pi1otguy Pattern Altitude

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    Wouldn't surprise me if some flavor of look for the sticker gatekeeping doesn't become a req for fuel truck drivers.
     
  40. Pi1otguy

    Pi1otguy Pattern Altitude

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    We are on the cusp of creating a generation of pilots who will never experience fouling. Until they get a few tanks of the old 100LL and fail to lean during ground ops.