Are Regionals that bad?

ShaggyAce

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ShaggyAce
Are the stories about working at regional airlines that bad? It seems one can serve some time flying as a CFI and meet the requirements to get a gig at some regionals. Are the stories about working at regional airlines truly as bad as they sound? I'd be out of college with my ratings in debt about $100,000, with an accounting degree.
 
Short answer: it is what you make of it. Bottom line, it's a job. If you approach the regional industry with an open mind, good sense of humor, and a lot of flexability, you'll be fine. Plenty of people have made very successful careers in the regionals; most seem to come to get their time, then move on to a real job (majors, charter, cargo, etc) as soon as the opportunity arises; and of course, I've know a few guys to quit after a year or two and go sell insurance. It mostly boils down to the individual and their personal situation.

Me? I've been in the regionals for 4 years now. There have been those days when I wanted nothing more than to park the plane at random a grass strip, call the company, say "good luck finding it," and walk away. But overall, I'd say the good days have outweighed the bad.

For my first two years I was home based, this last two years I've been a commuter. I think most people will aggree, being home based is key; commuting SUCKS. I can tell you, my overall attitude and quality of life were much much better when I was home based. But of course, my bases closed. Which is where the flexibility comes in.

If you're going to work for the regionals, make sure you do your homework. Learn as much as you can about things like trip rigs, duty rigs, minimum duty day, long call/short call reserve, junior-man/extension police, block-or-better, etc. A company's hourly work rate only tells part of the story; it's those "soft money" items, the work rules, that really make the difference between an OK company and a genuinely nice place to work. It will also directly affect your quality of life, and your paycheck every two weeks!

There is no definite answer, yes you're going to love it or no, it sucks stay away. As we say a lot around here: it is what it is. It's a job. It's usually a fun job, but it's just a job in the end. If you can show up, do your work, leave your problems and annoyance with scheduling outside the cockpit door, then go home and forget about it all for a few days, you'll be fine. That's what has worked for me for four years.
 
There is no definite answer, yes you're going to love it or no, it sucks stay away. As we say a lot around here: it is what it is. It's a job. It's usually a fun job, but it's just a job in the end. If you can show up, do your work, leave your problems and annoyance with scheduling outside the cockpit door, then go home and forget about it all for a few days, you'll be fine. That's what has worked for me for four years.

Note that for the past four years I've been doing essentially the same with my job. I'd say that's the key for any job. All jobs have good parts and bad parts. You need to be able to leave the bad parts at the door to maintain your sanity.
 
You'll probably make more money and have better hours if you sign on with the Regional as an accountant than as a pilot.
 
I should add, my loans wouldn't begin repayment or accrue interest until 2017
 
I should add, my loans wouldn't begin repayment or accrue interest until 2017

At a regional you may very well still be making only 30-40k as a flap and gear monkey in 2017....assuming you haven't been furloughed.
 
Short answer: it is what you make of it. Bottom line, it's a job.
+1. That would probably apply to any job, not just one as a regional pilot. I did not go the regional airline route but I have these observations from knowing people that have done so. It's probably OK if you are young and you only do it for a few years. But then what? Do you want to do that your whole career? The only way to get up into the higher pay scales is to stay for a long time, that is if the company doesn't go out of business first.
 
+1. That would probably apply to any job, not just one as a regional pilot. I did not go the regional airline route but I have these observations from knowing people that have done so. It's probably OK if you are young and you only do it for a few years. But then what? Do you want to do that your whole career? The only way to get up into the higher pay scales is to stay for a long time, that is if the company doesn't go out of business first.

Very true.

If professional flying is truly your passion, go for it. But the best advice that I can give you is to find some way to do it without getting yourself so heavily in debt that you are a miserably slave with not much to look forward to. It may take longer, but there are ways to get into the cockpit without a huge cloud of debt hanging over your head.
 
Watch this on YouTube - very true then and now!

So You Want to be a Regional Airline Pilot?

That is indeed a classic....I remember somebody posting that on Flighinfo.com something like 5 years ago. Sadly, pay hasn't changed all that much, because, like they say, there is always someone who is willing to do your job for less.
 
I entered the regional industry 3 years ago, and I'm now at my 3rd airline. I worked at one terrible, awful, crappy place and 2 overall decent airlines. At the first airline I was working for, I didn't commute, held a decent although tiring schedule, and we had a fair contract. I was home every day and was able to squeak out a few extra days off here and there, although 11 days off/mo was the norm. After a year and a half the airline decided to cut a fleet of airplanes, so I was furloughed and kicked out to the street.

Enter airline #2...the terrible, awful, crappy place. I commuted halfway across the country to my base, we had no contract, and the pay was awful. Being that we had no contract, we missed out on things like cancellation pay, daily scheduling benefits, and block-or-better (getting paid more for flights that take longer than scheduled). I was frequently scheduled to the very limits of the law (many 16 hour duty days and many days with 7.95 hours of scheduled flight time) and rarely had more than 9 days off each month (last May I ended up with a total of 5 days off for the month). I pretty much lived in a "crash pad" which consisted of a 2 bedroom apartment near NYC with 16 beds in it. I recall at one point 3 weeks passed without me ever making it home. After checking my logbook, I found that I flew every day for 14 days straight at one time. This kind of situation is usually prohibited when flying with a unionized airline that has a fair contract. So after about 6 months of being treated like this, I jumped ship once again.

At my current airline, I live in base while maintaining a good schedule that nets about half the month off (3-4 days per week). The pay is still low but the future is looking better than it ever has for me. I'm expecting to make around $25,000 for my first year here, and estimating around $34,000 during my second year.

Case-in-point, there are a wide array of experiences to be had when working for regional airlines. Do your research before jumping into the career. The pay at the regional level is not particularly good and it's probably not going to change. I personally couldn't imagine having that amount of debt hanging over my head while making 20-25K during the beginning years of my career. Your own choices about where to live and what company to work for have a major impact on your quality of life and how miserable or enjoyable the job is.
 
I entered the regional industry 3 years ago, and I'm now at my 3rd airline. I worked at one terrible, awful, crappy place and 2 overall decent airlines. At the first airline I was working for, I didn't commute, held a decent although tiring schedule, and we had a fair contract. I was home every day and was able to squeak out a few extra days off here and there, although 11 days off/mo was the norm. After a year and a half the airline decided to cut a fleet of airplanes, so I was furloughed and kicked out to the street.

Enter airline #2...the terrible, awful, crappy place. I commuted halfway across the country to my base, we had no contract, and the pay was awful. Being that we had no contract, we missed out on things like cancellation pay, daily scheduling benefits, and block-or-better (getting paid more for flights that take longer than scheduled). I was frequently scheduled to the very limits of the law (many 16 hour duty days and many days with 7.95 hours of scheduled flight time) and rarely had more than 9 days off each month (last May I ended up with a total of 5 days off for the month). I pretty much lived in a "crash pad" which consisted of a 2 bedroom apartment near NYC with 16 beds in it. I recall at one point 3 weeks passed without me ever making it home. After checking my logbook, I found that I flew every day for 14 days straight at one time. This kind of situation is usually prohibited when flying with a unionized airline that has a fair contract. So after about 6 months of being treated like this, I jumped ship once again.

At my current airline, I live in base while maintaining a good schedule that nets about half the month off (3-4 days per week). The pay is still low but the future is looking better than it ever has for me. I'm expecting to make around $25,000 for my first year here, and estimating around $34,000 during my second year.

Case-in-point, there are a wide array of experiences to be had when working for regional airlines. Do your research before jumping into the career. The pay at the regional level is not particularly good and it's probably not going to change. I personally couldn't imagine having that amount of debt hanging over my head while making 20-25K during the beginning years of my career. Your own choices about where to live and what company to work for have a major impact on your quality of life and how miserable or enjoyable the job is.


I remember as a child, I would study a list of occupations in the 1962 Encyclopedia. It listed Pilots at about the highest paid with an average pay of about $50K. All the others were well below that. So, that was a dream job; work at something enjoyable and get well paid too. That line of work never worked out for me, but I figure just as well. Don't really know if that pay was real back then or not...
 
The regional I flew for built schedules like this... knowing full well that you would go over 8 hours during the course of the day, but of course it was always due to circumstances beyond the control of the airline, even if it was an MEL item that restricted the airplane to .77 instead of .80. So the trips were built with compensatory rest already in the trip rig for the next day. Oughta be illegal.
The NPRM on flight time / duty time that came out last year had some language that would, in theory, help with these situations. I can't remember the exact wording, but it essentially said that if the company has any possible knowledge that the flight will take longer than scheduled (frequent ATC delays, chronically delayed flight, MELs, etc.), then the pilot's schedule must be adjusted for the longer time. I'd be impressed if much of that NPRM actually makes it into the final rule.
 
Look at the public numbers of any regional, and see if you can find one turning a profit with no significant debt load.

Oh wait, that's the majors... the regionals are worse. :D

What's the United/Continental merged airline up to now, well over $3 BILLION in debt still, aren't they? It's just amazing. Low fares at the cost of destroying all the equity in the companies.

There are only a very few truly viable airlines left from a purely business expense -- the rest are living on borrowed time that they borrowed from shareholders.

If you want to work for a company that at the slightest hiccup will have to file for bankruptcy, find an airline to work for...
 
United and Continental merged has NEGATIVE net asset value.

My ERAU mentee is now 32 and Captain of a G200 based in Kallingrad. That's right. Kallingrad. She learned enough Russian to pass the competency exam, and has left the country. When your best and brightest leave to run some other nation's business, your country is hosed.

The entire industry is just UPSIDE DOWN.
 
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