Carrying any Extra "Personal Baggage" on Your Flight?

K

KennyFlys

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No worries in Canada... the extra seat is free!

Top court backs free seat ruling for some disabled, obese travellers

The Supreme Court of Canada has upheld a regulatory ruling requiring airlines to offer a free extra seat to certain disabled and obese people.

In a decision released without comment Thursday, Canada's top court rejected an application by Air Canada and WestJet for permission to appeal a Canadian Transportation Agency ruling issued earlier this year.

The court's decision means airlines must offer a "one person, one fare" policy to disabled people who require room for an attendant during the flight or require extra room for a wheelchair, or for people who are clinically obese and take up more than one seat.
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I can go along with a seat for the disabled but not for a caretaker and certainly not due to obesity. It's getting crazy in Canada and count on it coming here, soon.
 
Where will the line be drawn? If a person is too obese to fit thru the door, then
what?
 
airlines will have to fly C17s and provide forklifts to load the porkers.:frown2:
 
I suppose it's a matter of determining what it is the airline is selling -- transportation or a seat. If the contract says "transportation," the problem is the airline's; if it's a "seat," it's the passenger's. In general, "common carriage" (which is what the airlines do) is a contract to transport a person from Point A to Point B as long as there's space left in the vehicle. How to fit the passenger in the vehicle is the carrier's problem, not the passenger's, and you can't say "I've got space for you, but not for you" -- you have to transport anyone who shows up with the fare as long as there's still space for one more.

I suppose the end result is that the airlines will have to charge everybody a tad more to make up for the occasional seat lost to someone who can't fit in one regular seat.
 
Charge per pound like the truckers do. Excess size pays excess prices. It would be an added incentive to lose weight before holiday.
 
If you're looking for examples of why two seats are necessary, hang out at the Golden Corral "all you can eat" buffet for a few days. That is one of their favorite grazing grounds, and you will routinely see them using one chair per cheek.

Ron Levy said:
I suppose it's a matter of determining what it is the airline is selling -- transportation or a seat. If the contract says "transportation," the problem is the airline's; if it's a "seat," it's the passenger's. In general, "common carriage" (which is what the airlines do) is a contract to transport a person from Point A to Point B as long as there's space left in the vehicle. How to fit the passenger in the vehicle is the carrier's problem, not the passenger's, and you can't say "I've got space for you, but not for you" -- you have to transport anyone who shows up with the fare as long as there's still space for one more.

I suppose the end result is that the airlines will have to charge everybody a tad more to make up for the occasional seat lost to someone who can't fit in one regular seat.
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wabower said:
If you're looking for examples of why two seats are necessary, hang out at the Golden Corral "all you can eat" buffet for a few days. That is one of their favorite grazing grounds, and you will routinely see them using one chair per cheek.
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Are you making that up?

---

It seems to me that a logical extension of this would be, if I am frightened or intimidated by close contact with people, and it is a diagnosed condition, then I should be "entitled" to a whole row to myself.

The inmates are indeed running the asylum.
 
Those anorexic women sure are funny.....

Or is that not cool, guys? :rolleyes:
 
BTW, what irritated me, always, was seeing people pay for an extra seat, but not get an extra seat....I'm no where near enough to be considered a "Person of Size," but I tell you what, if I was, I would insist that the seat next to me was empty if they were going to make me pay for it.
 
SkyHog said:
BTW, what irritated me, always, was seeing people pay for an extra seat, but not get an extra seat....I'm no where near enough to be considered a "Person of Size," but I tell you what, if I was, I would insist that the seat next to me was empty if they were going to make me pay for it.
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I've not seen that. What I've seen is folks who can't fit in the seat putting up the armrest and using two -- with a big extension strap to connect the belts. The airline doesn't like that without the person paying for two seats, because then everyone wants a double seat for comfort, and how do you allow one person to have that without allowing everyone to have the same? Answer: You charge by the seat, not by the person. Ditto the case of under-2 children -- if the parents want a seat for the kid, they have to pay for it. Otherwise, kid rides free but rides the lap.
 
Ron Levy said:
The airline doesn't like that without the person paying for two seats, because then everyone wants a double seat for comfort, and how do you allow one person to have that without allowing everyone to have the same?
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I'm trying to imagine how sitting in the middle of the two seats would be comfortable. You would be sitting on a ridge with another ridge hitting you in the back. But then again, if you have enough of your own padding...

Also, do you warn the airline in advance that you are supersized? If the airplane was full they would need to bump someone to make room for you.
 
AS long as they don't sit next to me. Every time I see one of those flesh Zeppelins heading down the aisle I pray to the god I don't believe in that they won't try to squeeze into my row.
 
I'm wondering if I should have titled the thread...

"Carrying any Extra "Personal Buttocks" on Your Flight?"

:D
 
flyersfan31 said:
AS long as they don't sit next to me. Every time I see one of those flesh Zeppelins heading down the aisle I pray to the god I don't believe in that they won't try to squeeze into my row.
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What is super hilarious, is seeing a girl with bulimia throwing up, extra points if she keeps it in a jar in her room so no one knows.

For supreme hilarity, call them "puke breath!"

:rolleyes:
 
SkyHog said:
What is super hilarious, is seeing a girl with bulimia throwing up, extra points if she keeps it in a jar in her room so no one knows.

For supreme hilarity, call them "puke breath!"

:rolleyes:
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If this is a not-so-gentle reminder to be politically correct, I suspect it's not going to work. Yes, we should treat all people with respect, but this is not a laughing matter. I once got pinned in the window seat of a Dash-8 (small, 3 seats per row, one on one side and two on the other) by someone who was so fat the armrest wouldn't come down. Not only did I feel like I was going to suffocate, there was a serious safety issue if rapid egress were required. Also the flight was full, so I couldn't move. I thank the fates to this day that the flight was only an hour long and nothing happened. I don't treat obese people any differently face-to-face than I treat anyone else (some of my favorite people are obese), but I think that the airlines are eventually going to have to address this for safety reasons if nothing else. Look at the plane that went down partially because it was overloaded by virtue of most pax exceeding the "normal" 170 lbs. Heck, I exceed the "normal" 170 lbs and even my doctor won't say I'm obese (and neither do so-called objective measures like BMI). (See picture, if you can see it.)

Judy
 
SkyHog said:
What is super hilarious, is seeing a girl with bulimia throwing up, extra points if she keeps it in a jar in her room so no one knows.

For supreme hilarity, call them "puke breath!"

:rolleyes:
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Presumably, her family will seek medical treatment for her condition and get her cured. I would argue the same should apply for the Flesh Zeppelins. They should seek a doctors care and not stop until they are an appropriate BMI. There is no reason to weigh 500lbs, and there is no reason to expect that I will be happy when a 500lb person attempts to take up half of my paid for airline seat, all the while heaving for air and sweating.

I am not slim. I am embarrassed by my weight. I'm doing something about it. The health crisis in this country is IN NO SMALL PART due to rampant obesity. It should be neither accepted nor even condoned. We all pay the price.

Obesity and taxes - those are my two hot button issues.
 
judypilot said:
If this is a not-so-gentle reminder to be politically correct, I suspect it's not going to work. Yes, we should treat all people with respect, but this is not a laughing matter. I once got pinned in the window seat of a Dash-8 (small, 3 seats per row, one on one side and two on the other) by someone who was so fat the armrest wouldn't come down.
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If the person next to me can't fit between the armrests of his/her seat, one of us is getting a different seat.
 
Ron Levy said:
If the person next to me can't fit between the armrests of his/her seat, one of us is getting a different seat.
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That seems like a reasonable measure since I can't recall the last passenger who could not fit in that defined space. I'd think the captain could refuse departure in such a case for "safety of flight and passengers."
 
I had that happen once; I was in a window seat; very large person got in the middle seat; squeezed in. As soon as the plane began move, she raised the arm rest so part of her could squiggle into my seat. I called the flight attendant. Flight was full. I did finally get moved. I had a laptop and carry on. No way I could work, much less sit on a long flight like that. It's just not fair to other passengers to put them in this position.

Best,

Dave
 
judypilot said:
If this is a not-so-gentle reminder to be politically correct, I suspect it's not going to work.
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I find it irritating that its perfectly acceptable to make fun of, and even call names at fat people, while bulimia and anorexia are treated with the respect they deserve.

You realize that both are eating disorders right? Would any of you tell an anorexic: "Just start eating, loser!"

Probably not. So telling a fat person to "Just stop eating" is just as absurd.

Flesh Zeppelin? Absolutely disgusting and uncalled for.

So no, its not political correctness I'm looking for, its the same respect that other eat disorders get.
 
SkyHog said:
I find it irritating that its perfectly acceptable to make fun of, and even call names at fat people, while bulimia and anorexia are treated with the respect they deserve.

You realize that both are eating disorders right? Would any of you tell an anorexic: "Just start eating, loser!"

Probably not. So telling a fat person to "Just stop eating" is just as absurd.

Flesh Zeppelin? Absolutely disgusting and uncalled for.

So no, its not political correctness I'm looking for, its the same respect that other eat disorders get.
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Showing respect for the person is one thing. It's their actions which got them into the predicament of being grossly overweight neither I nor anyone else has to respect. I've no body builder physique, myself. But, I don't have any problem fitting into the seats on any mailing tube I've been on.

In fact, I'd say the test should include... if you can fit into one seat and don't over-gross a 152 then you're good to go on any mailing tube. I have enough time teaching in one to pass that bill.
 
SkyHog said:
I find it irritating that its perfectly acceptable to make fun of, and even call names at fat people, while bulimia and anorexia are treated with the respect they deserve.

You realize that both are eating disorders right? Would any of you tell an anorexic: "Just start eating, loser!"

Probably not. So telling a fat person to "Just stop eating" is just as absurd.

Flesh Zeppelin? Absolutely disgusting and uncalled for.

So no, its not political correctness I'm looking for, its the same respect that other eat disorders get.
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I did know someone who was anorexic, and I did tell them they needed to start eating. I don't recall using the term "loser" it was probably a bit more colorful. Then again, when do I ever hold back? :D
 
KennyFlys said:
Showing respect for the person is one thing. It's their actions which got them into the predicament of being grossly overweight neither I nor anyone else has to respect.
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See, that's just it, Kenny. Its an eating disorder. No person would possibly eat enough to get supremely obese without an eating disorder. So what you're saying is the same as:

Look, I respect anorexic people, but I don't respect the fact that they're the ones killing themselves because they won't eat.

I'm not even arguing the point about the damn plane, because I agree, it sucks when your personal space is being violated. Last 2 flights I took the armrests were fixed down and could not be lifted, which sucked because I had the whole row to myself, I would have liked to have stretched out, but the incessant whining by people like you, Ron, and flyersfan ruined that one.

Either way, its the not the plane, its the absolutely ridiculous amount of disrespect shown towards obesity. I'm serious, if you're okay with making fun of them then you're okay with making fun of all eating disorders and probably psychological disorders.

"Hey crazy! Take your lithium and shut up!"

Nice.
 
Nick, There's a difference between having respect for the person and having respect for their actions. In the most extreme example, a court may show respect for the individual before them but that doesn't mean the individual's actions have to be appreciated for the harm caused to themselves or others.

This applies whether the subject is overweight or anorexic. I can see where many are a disorder, particularly with overweight but that's not always the case. With others its simply a matter of not saying "No" when they should. Lack of willpower? Perhaps desire outweighs the risk and harm caused. Such poor judgment isn't unlike that which may get a pilot killed because he refused to stay on the ground.

Anorexia is a whole different story. That truly is a mental health issue, influenced from either external sources or from within. It has a wide spectrum of causes and actions that all culminate into your term of "eating disorders."

On the flip side, I think the mental health industry has pushed "Eating Disorders" as a means to obtain clients and benefit itself. It is an industry and a very lucrative one! More often than not, as said before, all that's really needed is to say "No." I'm guilty of that one more than a few times. I've turned a lot around by eating salad more often.

Now, if only I could buy romaine lettuce in bulk and make it last between trips to the store!
 
The difference, with regard to this thread, is that people with anorexia don't invade other people's space on airliners or anywhere else. That's where some of the hostility comes from, I think.
 
Everskyward said:
The difference, with regard to this thread, is that people with anorexia don't invade other people's space on airliners or anywhere else. That's where some of the hostility comes from, I think.
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Well no, but it could be said that sitting next to a bulimic could be stinky though.

Some things are just better off not said.
 
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