Enough jobs for the student pilot population?

There were approximately 70,000 student certificates issued last year, so the answer is no. How many of them are career wannabes we don’t know.
 
Groundpounder said:
There are very few flying jobs that offer the money and QOL of a legacy airline job with a few years of seniority. Top tier corporate job, maybe, but those are very hard to get, and those can change in a heartbeat.
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True.

That said, pipelines and electric power transmission companies employ a decent number of line patrol pilots, both fixed-wing and helicopter. The posts I've seen seem to indicate a low 6-digit salary range, and those companies tend to have good benefits and job security.
 
FormerHangie said:
There were approximately 70,000 student certificates issued last year, so the answer is no. How many of them are career wannabes we don’t know.
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A fair number of those are foreign students, headed back to their homeland as soon as they hit 1500 or whatever is required to drive an ATR into a mountainside.
 
Want a job flying for an airline, learn Spanish, Afrikaner, or Chinese.... not for use while you're working, more so to keep yourself from starving and getting around when you're not working.
 
ateamer said:
A fair number of those are foreign students, headed back to their homeland as soon as they hit 1500 or whatever is required to drive an ATR into a mountainside.
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Probably just as many are like myself where they get their Private or Instrument for personal use with no intention of going into commercial aviation.
 
I think no matter how you slice it, an airline career has a large element of chance to it. I was on the verge of a proto-airline career when 9/11 happened. I never made it to the airlines because I wasn't willing/able to make the sacrifices necessary to withstand the recovery period. Some people I know did make the sacrifices and now have the careers. Others I know had the careers and opted out anyway. I think it boils down to how much you are willing to do and how much you are willing to sacrifice to achieve your goal in the face of all the adversity that you will face along the way.
 
Watching this for my kids sake. 16 year old and 11 year old both want to be professional pilots. Plan is for my oldest to be private-instrument-commercial-cfi by age 18 with lots of time in our back yard bushplane. Hopefully getting paid to fly something as soon as age allows, and maybe start training his little sister. He's worried about the unknowns, but we'll do everything possible to support him along the way.
 
Forgive my occasional post-modernist bend, but control is an illusion. Plans are in the end, but a mere coping mechanism. 38 special had it right. I used to have it all drawn out, then the steerable wheels came off the proverbial bus. I've been "winging" it ever since, well since 2005 for sure. Username checkity-checks!

I know there's a lot of nostalgia for the "I wouldn't do a thing different", but I do have some regrets, and I would do some things differently in my life if I could do it over. I'm not inclined at this stage to steer my kid towards professional flying as a primary career. If he ever endemically shows interest in young adulthood, of course I'll guide him and give him the inside baseball gouge. So far he hasn't shown any interest in flying, in spite of my occupation and (well, until last year) recreational access to flying.

I'm sure his journey will be convoluted and imperfect, as mine has been. Which is to say, Human. And given my opening statement, that's ok. There but for the grace of god go we....
 
SoonerAviator said:
Probably just as many are like myself where they get their Private or Instrument for personal use with no intention of going into commercial aviation.
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That's my story. I had an opportunity in 2000 to attend Flight Safety for a FO rating in a Leer, I think it was in the 35 but can't recall for sure.

I was halfway through a Federal career which was a great job with awesome benefits. I was flying photo chase in the back of QF-4S's out of Pt Mugu Ca and China Lake. Chasing Tomahawks, SLAM ER's, JSOW's on and on. Good times so I declined. Can't help but wonder where that would have gone had I accepted.

I retired almost 8 years ago now. I just beat my brains out going nowhere at 90kts in my C-150. I'm up about 950 hours now. And I paid for every hour of it. Had a break from 2004-2017 as I was traveling a lot for my job.

Friends I know who haul the line tell me flying used to be fun. Back when they had to pay for it :D
 
Pardon my ignorance. I am old enough and have a small enough ego that I don't care to be a wide body captain. I just want to fly instead of working.
I do however as a dad and husband to a self employed wife need benefits.

Are there part 135 jobs out there that are stable? The draw of the airlines that I see is days away from home seem fewer than the little guys. I am seeing 10 on 10 off, 15 on, 10 off, etc which is a no go.
Most of my friends at Envoy are more 4 on 3 off schedules plus all the benefits. I am not overly concerned about pay rate as I am unemployed now and so anything is better than nothing.

That said, is there a decent work life balance outside the airlines and is there a job board for aviation jobs? I saw one but they want you to pay to join.
I have just been on airline apps and directly on airline sites.

I have 1320 hours and I am doing 15-20 a week right now to try to get to 1500.
I'm hearing all the news about hiring slowing but I also see the retirement numbers for the next few years are still quite high if airlinepilotcentral is to be trusted.
 
eman1200 said:
bro, c'mon, man!
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I have only ever gained employment from indeed and Careerbuilder.
I see pilot jobs there but I assume there is an alternate goto board specific to flying.
The first few google results ask for subscription.

I saw a couple others but they look older and less professional than the sidnaw site.
 
Go over to CAE DFW West and also FlightSafety Dallas and apply for a sim support position. No overnights (but some late night).
 
Mooney Fan said:
That's my story. I had an opportunity in 2000 to attend Flight Safety for a FO rating in a Leer, I think it was in the 35 but can't recall for sure.

I was halfway through a Federal career which was a great job with awesome benefits. I was flying photo chase in the back of QF-4S's out of Pt Mugu Ca and China Lake. Chasing Tomahawks, SLAM ER's, JSOW's on and on. Good times so I declined. Can't help but wonder where that would have gone had I accepted.

I retired almost 8 years ago now. I just beat my brains out going nowhere at 90kts in my C-150. I'm up about 950 hours now. And I paid for every hour of it. Had a break from 2004-2017 as I was traveling a lot for my job.

Friends I know who haul the line tell me flying used to be fun. Back when they had to pay for it :D
Click to expand...
I watched an uncle flying for Delta in the 80s/90s go through a few furloughs before he finally hung it up. Another uncle flew corporate and certainly struggled early-on but eventually landed a great gig where he eventually became chief pilot of a 3-jet (all Falcons) operation. However, he was gone a lot, and sometimes his kids (my cousins) needed a bit of attention (correction) at home that he wasn't there to provide. Professional flying can be tough on young families. I changed my mind in high school that I'd just fly for fun and do a different career. It's worked out great so far, but I could always try and do a flying gig (I'd 100% never go airlines, just a personal choice) once my kids are in high school and ready to do their own thing.
 
SoonerAviator said:
I watched an uncle flying for Delta in the 80s/90s go through a few furloughs before he finally hung it up. Another uncle flew corporate and certainly struggled early-on but eventually landed a great gig where he eventually became chief pilot of a 3-jet (all Falcons) operation. However, he was gone a lot, and sometimes his kids (my cousins) needed a bit of attention (correction) at home that he wasn't there to provide. Professional flying can be tough on young families. I changed my mind in high school that I'd just fly for fun and do a different career. It's worked out great so far, but I could always try and do a flying gig (I'd 100% never go airlines, just a personal choice) once my kids are in high school and ready to do their own thing.
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Delta had one furlough in the nineties of around 400 pilots if I recall correctly. They had zero furloughs in the eighties and if your uncle was employed by Delta in the Eighties he was never furloughed in the nineties. If you want to be home every night and work for a major airline it’s actually not that hard if you are welling to move to where they train. You can become a sim instructor or request one of the hundreds of office jobs available. If you really want to fly and be home simply pass on upgrades until you are very senior in category and fly turns.
 
Jeff767 said:
Delta had one furlough in the nineties of around 400 pilots if I recall correctly. They had zero furloughs in the eighties and if your uncle was employed by Delta in the Eighties he was never furloughed in the nineties. If you want to be home every night and work for a major airline it’s actually not that hard if you are welling to move to where they train. You can become a sim instructor or request one of the hundreds of office jobs available. If you really want to fly and be home simply pass on upgrades until you are very senior in category and fly turns.
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I don't disagree. I believe he was getting paid pretty well to sit at home when they did the furlough in the 90s. He moved around plenty, from a few spots in the Northeast, down to Atlanta, Washington DC. He eventually just had enough of it and retired. My comment was just to say that it can be tough, and finding the gigs that keep you at home most nights can be difficult to obtain. Airline jobs like that generally require that you be located at a hub, which isn't desirable for many. Until you fly for several years to build up that seniority, you're going to be flying the red-eyes and overnights. It is what it is, and those that accept that lifestyle are paid pretty handsomely for it.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Pardon my ignorance. I am old enough and have a small enough ego that I don't care to be a wide body captain. I just want to fly instead of working.
I do however as a dad and husband to a self employed wife need benefits.

Are there part 135 jobs out there that are stable? The draw of the airlines that I see is days away from home seem fewer than the little guys. I am seeing 10 on 10 off, 15 on, 10 off, etc which is a no go.
Most of my friends at Envoy are more 4 on 3 off schedules plus all the benefits. I am not overly concerned about pay rate as I am unemployed now and so anything is better than nothing.

That said, is there a decent work life balance outside the airlines and is there a job board for aviation jobs? I saw one but they want you to pay to join.
I have just been on airline apps and directly on airline sites.

I have 1320 hours and I am doing 15-20 a week right now to try to get to 1500.
I'm hearing all the news about hiring slowing but I also see the retirement numbers for the next few years are still quite high if airlinepilotcentral is to be trusted.
Click to expand...
Sent you a PM
 
hindsight2020 said:
Forgive my occasional post-modernist bend, but control is an illusion. Plans are in the end, but a mere coping mechanism. 38 special had it right. I used to have it all drawn out, then the steerable wheels came off the proverbial bus. I've been "winging" it ever since, well since 2005 for sure. Username checkity-checks!

I know there's a lot of nostalgia for the "I wouldn't do a thing different", but I do have some regrets, and I would do some things differently in my life if I could do it over. I'm not inclined at this stage to steer my kid towards professional flying as a primary career. If he ever endemically shows interest in young adulthood, of course I'll guide him and give him the inside baseball gouge. So far he hasn't shown any interest in flying, in spite of my occupation and (well, until last year) recreational access to flying.

I'm sure his journey will be convoluted and imperfect, as mine has been. Which is to say, Human. And given my opening statement, that's ok. There but for the grace of god go we....
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Very well said!
 
hindsight2020 said:
but I do have some regrets, and I would do some things differently in my life if I could do it over.
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If only I could go back to a certain spring morning in 2007 and drink a couple of bottles of water before my holographic depth perception test, perhaps I would have had 1 anchor on my uniform instead of two. NAMI whammi for the win.
SixPapaCharlie said:
I just want to fly instead of working.
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I think that this is my mindset at the moment too. If I could make a living off of playing music or flying I wouldn't be typing this from my government-appointed office with all of its 1970's wood paneling charm.
 
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