Missing Plane Paris, Texas

[TommyG]

It's just incredible to me how much stress the kids are under, and how few resources they have to deal with it. With so little life experience they just don't have the tools to put setbacks in context. High stakes standardized testing just adds fuel to the fire. It's a damn shame.

Gotta disagree with a portion of that. I think kids, adults, everyone has a whole lot more resources to get help. Even mental, emotional problems are more easily accepted than 20 years ago. Now you don’t even need to leave the house to speak to someone, which takes away the embarrassment someone may feel walking into an office, now just click of a button it can be all online.

But the biggest obstacle is and has always been the person needing help, ask for it. Sometimes they don’t know it until it’s too late.

 

[texasclouds]

Sad to hear.

 

[Warlock]

In the loss of my Arrow…Murder/Suicide with the victim a five year old kindergartener my Lawyers conducted a deposition of the AME that recently signed him off…basically said if he’s not crazy in my office there nothing I can do. Fact that the pilot worked for the FAA and they helped facilitate the whole situation was no consequence or factor. I spent until recently five years with four lawsuits. If we had known he was wanted for child molestation or anything else the club would have terminated his privileges…but as the owner on a leaseback operated by an LLC I was sued anyway. Long story short an AME gets the same immunity as a Federal Agency…

 

[CENTURION]

Sadness, That’s all I can say on this one. It’s something special that we can all feel the sadness with many of us never have known this young man but share the common experience of flight. May he rest in peace in the heavens as we pass by him above and keep him and his family in our thoughts.

 

[MFE]

The person on the radio sounds pretty young, makes the whole thing even more unfortunate
I hope the tower guy gets some time off - probably a little jarring to know you're the last person they talked to.

Perhaps even worse is the guilt of knowing this pilot just confessed his final intentions to you, thinking he was communicating fully and clearly, and you had to ask for a say again because you didn't catch it.

 

[aftCG]

It's just incredible to me how much stress the kids are under, and how few resources they have to deal with it. With so little life experience they just don't have the tools to put setbacks in context. High stakes standardized testing just adds fuel to the fire. It's a damn shame.

What incredible stress are you referring to?

In the 1940s we were sending teenage pilots off to fight the Nazis. They came back as 21 year olds after 25-50 missions having seen horrors none of us can imagine. No mental health resources offered or available.
I've met some of them. After the war they became CEOs of large corporations or were otherwise very successful.

 

[SixPapaCharlie]

What incredible stress are you referring to?

In the 1940s we were sending teenage pilots off to fight the Nazis. They came back as 21 year olds after 25-50 missions having seen horrors none of us can imagine. No mental health resources offered or available.
I've met some of them. After the war they became CEOs of large corporations or were otherwise very successful.

As a parent of a 14 and 16 year old I will tell you the difference is when I was a kid, the bullying stopped at 3:00 PM and was limited to kids on the playground.
Now it follows them home and to an extent defines how they see themselves. We have 12 year olds and 14 year olds hanging themselves in our school district. I don't recall any of that when I was a kid.
The last few years of Highschool, i was a fa@@ot and retard because I drove a beat up old honda civic, didn't have any friends, had long hair and dressed weird. I really didn't care but nobody was making videos and memes and spoof accounts of me that spread far beyond that group of kids.

I can't imagine opening your phone in the privacy of your room after hours to "escape" and seeing strangers sharing viral memes of you to your entire school. There exists an age range where that type of thing is devastating. This generation is dealing with something that never lets up. My kids are doing well but a lot of their friends are targets and the stories they share with me are heart breaking. No, its not fighting Nazis and I suspect "teenage" pilots successfully returning from winning a war probably had pretty good confidence and also PTSD that they don't talk about. I bet more didn't become CEOs than did.

 

[aterry1067]

As a parent of a 14 and 16 year old I will tell you the difference is when I was a kid, the bullying stopped at 3:00 PM and was limited to kids on the playground.
Now it follows them home and to an extent defines how they see themselves. We have 12 year olds and 14 year olds hanging themselves in our school district. I don't recall any of that when I was a kid.
The last few years of Highschool, i was a fa@@ot and retard because I drove a beat up old honda civic, didn't have any friends, had long hair and dressed weird. I really didn't care but nobody was making videos and memes and spoof accounts of me that spread far beyond that group of kids.

I can't imagine opening your phone in the privacy of your room after hours to "escape" and seeing strangers sharing viral memes of you to your entire school. There exists an age range where that type of thing is devastating. This generation is dealing with something that never lets up. My kids are doing well but a lot of their friends are targets and the stories they share with me are heart breaking. No, its not fighting Nazis and I suspect "teenage" pilots successfully returning from winning a war probably had pretty good confidence and also PTSD that they don't talk about. I bet more didn't become CEOs than did.

Well said.

 

[3393RP]

Perhaps even worse is the guilt of knowing this pilot just confessed his final intentions to you, thinking he was communicating fully and clearly, and you had to ask for a say again because you didn't catch it.

Why would that induce guilt? This is a terrible incident. I know, because of a young man's suicide in my close family. But those peripheral to it had no involvement in the sad decision, and it would be mentally unhealthy to believe so.

 

[Flymy47]

As a parent of a 14 and 16 year old I will tell you the difference is when I was a kid, the bullying stopped at 3:00 PM and was limited to kids on the playground.
Now it follows them home and to an extent defines how they see themselves. We have 12 year olds and 14 year olds hanging themselves in our school district. I don't recall any of that when I was a kid.
The last few years of Highschool, i was a fa@@ot and retard because I drove a beat up old honda civic, didn't have any friends, had long hair and dressed weird. I really didn't care but nobody was making videos and memes and spoof accounts of me that spread far beyond that group of kids.

I can't imagine opening your phone in the privacy of your room after hours to "escape" and seeing strangers sharing viral memes of you to your entire school. There exists an age range where that type of thing is devastating. This generation is dealing with something that never lets up. My kids are doing well but a lot of their friends are targets and the stories they share with me are heart breaking. No, its not fighting Nazis and I suspect "teenage" pilots successfully returning from winning a war probably had pretty good confidence and also PTSD that they don't talk about. I bet more didn't become CEOs than did.

Excellent post. My wife is a school administrator, and I have heard her say this almost verbatim, but it's absolutely true and the other thing is, thanks to technology it's starting much earlier. The amounts and types of stuff she deals with in a middle school environment is unbelievably brutal. And then there are the parents... You know the ones. School is but a daycare. I hope she doesn't stroke out, I really like her.

 

[Bill]

What incredible stress are you referring to?

In the 1940s we were sending teenage pilots off to fight the Nazis.

From the National Museum of the Air Force:

“During 1943, only about 25% of Eighth Air Force bomber crewmen completed their 25-mission tours—the other 75% were killed, severely wounded, or captured. Despite knowing the poor odds of finishing their tours, bomber crews courageously pressed their attacks mission after mission.”

Somehow flying a spam can over Texas doesn’t seem as daunting.

 

[SixPapaCharlie]

Excellent post. My wife is a school administrator, and I have heard her say this almost verbatim, but it's absolutely true and the other thing is, thanks to technology it's starting much earlier. The amounts and types of stuff she deals with in a middle school environment is unbelievably brutal. And then there are the parents... You know the ones. School is but a daycare. I hope she doesn't stroke out, I really like her.

My wife worked at the school up until last year. Can't reprimand kids because their parents threaten a variety of actions. A portion of the kids have real issues and a larger portion of the kids pretend to have issues because having a label is crazy trendy right now. Everybody wants to be ADD, On the spectrum or some gender bending thing. It makes it nearly impossible to differentiate kids with real concerns from kids that want a label. It is 180 from when I was in middle school. She just got to where she couldn't do what she was hired to do because she was being confronted by parents constantly. But kids now are mean as ****. Imagine your kid comes home and tells you someone setup an Instagram account pretending to be them and announcing they were coming out of the closet or claiming to be screwing a teacher and sharing it around school. My generation isn't doing the best job of parenting the next generation.

 

[SoonerAviator]

My wife worked at the school up until last year. Can't reprimand kids because their parents threaten a variety of actions. A portion of the kids have real issues and a larger portion of the kids pretend to have issues because having a label is crazy trendy right now. Everybody wants to be ADD, On the spectrum or some gender bending thing. It makes it nearly impossible to differentiate kids with real concerns from kids that want a label. It is 180 from when I was in middle school. She just got to where she couldn't do what she was hired to do because she was being confronted by parents constantly. But kids now are mean as ****. Imagine your kid comes home and tells you someone setup an Instagram account pretending to be them and announcing they were coming out of the closet or claiming to be screwing a teacher and sharing it around school. My generation isn't doing the best job of parenting the next generation.

I have many friends who are educators in OK and TX. The stories they tell about parent/administration interactions is just absolutely flooring. The teacher's hands are usually tied and there are no repercussions for a students actions (and generally have absurd parental demands). I started elementary school in the late-80's when the Principal still had a paddle and if I did something bad-enough that my parents were called I was probably getting spanked at home, too, lol.

I have a niece who is and has always been a fantastic student and athlete. She currently plays D1 softball for Univ. of Tulsa and is working on her Engineering degree. There was a period for about a year or two (Soph/Junior in HS) where she was getting bullied pretty hard by people who were previously her friends. Lots of online/electronic stuff posted about her, which was counter to the facts that she was pretty straight-laced morally. Caused her quite a bit of grief for a while, but she is fortunate to have pretty strong resolve and a good support system with family and church. I can imagine that with a lot of the kids who get bullied, they may not have that support system to use as a sounding wall and voice of reason. With no one to talk you down off the ledge, some kids don't figure out how to rationalize things. Ends badly, like in this incident.

 

[Racerx]

My wife worked at the school up until last year. Can't reprimand kids because their parents threaten a variety of actions. A portion of the kids have real issues and a larger portion of the kids pretend to have issues because having a label is crazy trendy right now. Everybody wants to be ADD, On the spectrum or some gender bending thing. It makes it nearly impossible to differentiate kids with real concerns from kids that want a label. It is 180 from when I was in middle school. She just got to where she couldn't do what she was hired to do because she was being confronted by parents constantly. But kids now are mean as ****. Imagine your kid comes home and tells you someone setup an Instagram account pretending to be them and announcing they were coming out of the closet or claiming to be screwing a teacher and sharing it around school. My generation isn't doing the best job of parenting the next generation.

South Park has been saying this for years about some of these conditions. I know anxiety is real. But a lot of these people are just self absorbed and whiny, looking for attention and sympathy...or a reason to be lazy.

A former employee is the welding instructor at a local community college and one of his students thinks she's a cat, complete with a tail. We have normalized and even rewarded this behaviour which has been exacerbated by social media. And that's forgetting all of the other conditions that these kids claim. And it absolutely makes it more difficult for the kids that actually deal with the issues.

I really don't recall these things in the mid 00's, but the advent of social media has made the bullying and mental health situation so much worse.

Pretty good bit about schools and the problems teachers deal with along with their own resignation.

 

[Flymy47]

My wife worked at the school up until last year. Can't reprimand kids because their parents threaten a variety of actions. A portion of the kids have real issues and a larger portion of the kids pretend to have issues because having a label is crazy trendy right now. Everybody wants to be ADD, On the spectrum or some gender bending thing. It makes it nearly impossible to differentiate kids with real concerns from kids that want a label. It is 180 from when I was in middle school. She just got to where she couldn't do what she was hired to do because she was being confronted by parents constantly. But kids now are mean as ****. Imagine your kid comes home and tells you someone setup an Instagram account pretending to be them and announcing they were coming out of the closet or claiming to be screwing a teacher and sharing it around school. My generation isn't doing the best job of parenting the next generation.

I don't blame your wife, it's a big reason mine can't hold onto qualified, highly effective staff. They realize the pay isn't worth the abuse. Hell, HER pay isn't worth what she has to deal with. I'm not relieved to hear it's the same with kids where I am, but... Yes. It's exactly the same. Pretty sure we are the same generation (I'm a 70's model), and yes, some of our generation could have done a better job. Like you said, social media just makes it so hard, because it's always there. I think I'm going to change my son's name to Sue before he gets to middle school.

Keep fighting the good fight. Who knows, maybe sanity will prevail?

 

[Jim K]

I don't blame your wife, it's a big reason mine can't hold onto qualified, highly effective staff. They realize the pay isn't worth the abuse. Hell, HER pay isn't worth what she has to deal with. I'm not relieved to hear it's the same with kids where I am, but... Yes. It's exactly the same. Pretty sure we are the same generation (I'm a 70's model), and yes, some of our generation could have done a better job. Like you said, social media just makes it so hard, because it's always there. I think I'm going to change my son's name to Sue before he gets to middle school.

Keep fighting the good fight. Who knows, maybe sanity will prevail?

I just hope it doesn't take another world war to put things in perspective. Life in the developed "west" is so easy compared to the conditions humans evolved under that I think we're inventing our own problems. 3/4 of the world is too worried about what they're going to eat today to think about where they are on the various spectrums.

 

[Mxfarm]

It's just incredible to me how much stress the kids are under, and how few resources they have to deal with it. With so little life experience they just don't have the tools to put setbacks in context. High stakes standardized testing just adds fuel to the fire. It's a damn shame.

Get them off social media ( I know, here we are ) reading the fake news about those you associate with would depress anyone.

 

[Racerx]

I just hope it doesn't take another world war to put things in perspective. Life in the developed "west" is so easy compared to the conditions humans evolved under that I think we're inventing our own problems. 3/4 of the world is too worried about what they're going to eat today to think about where they are on the various spectrums.

And so many of the younger generation have lost perspective or just completely unaware of how easy we have it. I feel old. Gonna go yell at these clouds now.

 

[Half Fast]

With so little life experience they just don't have the tools to put setbacks in context.

I agree, but I'll add that it's the job of the parents to give them those tools.

You have to have a license to fly a plane, a license to drive a car, even a license to catch a fish, but any unqualified moron can be a parent. Wish I knew an answer, but I don't.

 

[RyanShort1]

Education and ideology are largely to blame.

I personally believe a lot of this is related to the fact that marriage is something oriented towards a higher-power-oriented thing, and *should* inform parenting and purpose.

Also, beliefs about what happens after you die should significantly alter what you think about things like suicide. If nothing happens, and nihilism is the truth, then ending it is of no consequence except to others, who you obviously don't care about, but discussing that further would probably violate the ROC.

 

[Half Fast]

then ending it is of no consequence except to others, who you obviously don't care about,

Which makes it a very selfish act.

Some years ago, a friend's 17 year old daughter was killed in a car crash. A year later to the day, my friend's husband sat on their daughter's grave and shot himself. I understand his grief had become overwhelming, but in his act he abandoned a wife and a 14 year old son who needed him, and it left the son wondering why his dad cared so much for his deceased sister and so yet so little for him.

And that's hardly the only example I've personally witnessed. Suicide is devastating so many people left behind, and impacts their lives forever.

 

[FatherPilot]

In light of recent talk about evolution in thinking on mental health by the FAA, I saw this and my heart sank. Will this freeze up the wheels of progress or accelerate positive change at OKC?

Private Pilot Allegedly Dies by Suicide in an Airplane - FLYING Magazine

A private pilot allegedly stole an airplane from ATP Flight School in Addison and used it to commit suicide.

www.flyingmag.com

 

[GeorgeC]

By MC decision, thread to remain locked.

From the RoC, a reminder:

Goals of the Forums

• Show respect at all times.
• Help build the Community.
• Encourage discussion, interest and education in all things aviation.