Oil drain for piper arrow

ArrowFlyer86

ArrowFlyer86

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The Little Arrow That Could
Curious if anyone knows where I can pick up an adapter that fits this oil-drain design? The last 2 A&Ps who have done oil changes on it said I should carry one with me since it's non-standard, and without one they end up having to manually hold it in place as they drain the oil (also runs up the labor bill)... Apparently they're normally circular, not hexagonal. Curious if anyone knows where I can get one?

the plug
Um4O-_alLqcEKS5LuyRmFvcafS0K4nMBB5-6QPt7LQpAG6PfzcwyR6v7kjYhLkBUjV--Ex8-lA4j9zD-ij92zUNvfscn93Iy5_XwrObQFbM2sGNW0bhYJhhqohNiMlIcDtU3pG96jO7braNxyCJz8bFgsYdBCdGVj5JuSqfZr-Bw5Cc4NcGaLxDQx5X35igzerG2OVm_neLEprTyCEg4mEMJ449xi76fSmGoiAwzbIfXZ4YOyX4u8m96yVikomcNMd5Bzhl1XVt7D1XMaPyUXBIYyNkLCc_yiBylzLBN6HprpNwdY7rgGBWkh3ZTei3bWA9vJAmBJENnWnhvAqVZt7sreeAxL26cNNF2RM2CAsXIPe2OEK-EsyEh1Vr6mDiRkkdZagWWzdC8cQYtsj3esIDHUmid3xQ1miyCFJfewg1-jpzQsBeAdnDqpFn8dR0uJQZrYQkxzXsUdy4qZ2w43kE9FxuEYpTuadyBi668PPW7z8LYcHUs87Ss4IGO-DGY0b0NoxBpe7nzdzI8bnShF4vGzXMK2xzcmbLT-o43CC0FJzgumQg_Oa2dXDoa7Ew4K9E3Z7rqTjQiiteWDpwpgNs_rqFXcxQtWwPYIFS7yI20WjTsSnE5FKNuwa-hHlstqXJrBIv-CZRSB_uot4IHMIe06nhWW0svhfx9JkCKW3MJT3afuK3nWGrDzvd92YiJOm9eU4-mYLdA8nu1p5OXnCP2dYrym-7oZLQdNFDzjmcoZ6sNIZjEhio9yfzQiSo=w977-h1297-no
 
Funny, I was just reading about an Arrow accident where the nose gear retracted into an aftermarket drain and dumped out all the oil...
 
asicer said:
Funny, I was just reading about an Arrow accident where the nose gear retracted into an aftermarket drain and dumped out all the oil...
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Yeah, that's why they couldn't install the "standardized" one. I forget the name for it "flush - quick drain adapater" or something like that? Apparently it can block the gear and that causes a lot more problems than an inconvenient oil change ;)
 
That looks like this quick drain: https://www.ebay.com/itm/162083244049 See also Piper SL 910 & AD 81-11-02R1 ... I think you may be able to use the Curtis CCA-38001 activation tool with that, the 492-172V kit originally came with both pieces and I haven't seen a PN for the separate activation piece. The Curtis CCB-38000 valve is a PMA replacement for that valve, and comes with the tool as well. Also, it looks like it's not safety wired? You may want to look at replacing it with another quick drain (depending on if your aircraft is subject to the AD, you might need to file an AMOC to use it). The Saf-Air F50 (https://www.saf-air.com/products/oil-valves.html#twopieceoildrainvalve) is a nice option. It's a low profile 2-piece drain. Has a cap with an o-ring that will prevent anything from inadvertently pushing up the valve, as well as providing a second seal in case of o-ring failure in the valve. To drain the oil you unscrew the cap and screw on the drain adaptor and out comes the oil. I use the F62 on a number of continental engines. The F50 is for the Lycoming Engines. It comes with one drain adaptor, but you can buy additional ones, so you could have one on a hose in your hangar and one in the glove box for a shop on the road. There are a number of options that will work, but you do need to ensure that there is no interference with the airframe.
 
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Ryan Klems said:
That looks like this quick drain: https://www.ebay.com/itm/162083244049 See also Piper SL 910 & AD 81-11-02R1 ... I think you may be able to use the Curtis CCA-38001 activation tool with that, the 492-172V kit originally came with both pieces and I haven't seen a PN for the separate activation piece. The Curtis CCB-38000 valve is a PMA replacement for that valve, and comes with the tool as well. Also, it looks like it's not safety wired? You may want to look at replacing it with another quick drain (depending on if your aircraft is subject to the AD, you might need to file an AMOC to use it). The Saf-Air F50 (https://www.saf-air.com/products/oil-valves.html#twopieceoildrainvalve) is a nice option. It's a low profile 2-piece drain. Has a cap with an o-ring that will prevent anything from inadvertently pushing up the valve, as well as providing a second seal in case of o-ring failure in the valve. To drain the oil you unscrew the cap and screw on the drain adaptor and out comes the oil. I use the F62 on a number of continental engines. The F50 is for the Lycoming Engines. It comes with one drain adaptor, but you can buy additional ones, so you could have one on a hose in your hangar and one in the glove box for a shop on the road. There are a number of options that will work, but you do need to ensure that there is no interference with the airframe.
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$1259.95!!!!!!!!
 
Gotcha, thanks for the info!

Sounds like I should look around for the Curtis CCA-38001 activation tool for my immediate solution to drain the oil?

I can also ask my shop about replacing the quick-drain all together with a different one, but will probably save that for when it's in for the annual!
 
Tom Wells said:
Gotcha, thanks for the info!

Sounds like I should look around for the Curtis CCA-38001 activation tool for my immediate solution to drain the oil?

I can also ask my shop about replacing the quick-drain all together with a different one, but will probably save that for when it's in for the annual!
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McFarlane and AirPower both sell the CCA-38001 tool < $20. I can't guarantee it'll work with the piper valve, but the CCB-38000 is a copy of that valve, so it's a shot. I sent piper tech support an email to see if they'll send along the P/N for the activation tool for the 492-172 valve, to see if it's available separately.
 
Ryan Klems said:
McFarlane and AirPower both sell the CCA-38001 tool < $20. I can't guarantee it'll work with the piper valve, but the CCB-38000 is a copy of that valve, so it's a shot. I sent piper tech support an email to see if they'll send along the P/N for the activation tool for the 492-172 valve, to see if it's available separately.
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Wow thanks a lot! It's worth a shot for me to get it. Worst case scenario I'm out 20$ or so. But the cost of not trying is that my oil changes have taken like 3x longer than they should...
 
I've actually not seen one of these valves in person, so I was just presuming there was a tool, and I've been a bit surprised to not see the tool called out separately, as one would guess that it would be easy to lose and need replacing. Reading the maintenance manual for aircraft that came originally with that quick drain I see this "Remove the engine cowl and on PA-28R-201 airplanes open the oil drain valve by pushing the center of the drain up and turning counterclockwise." Actually sounds like it is tool-less and should lock open on it's own. Can't really try that out until your next oil change I suppose :)
 
Ryan Klems said:
I've actually not seen one of these valves in person, so I was just presuming there was a tool, and I've been a bit surprised to not see the tool called out separately, as one would guess that it would be easy to lose and need replacing. Reading the maintenance manual for aircraft that came originally with that quick drain I see this "Remove the engine cowl and on PA-28R-201 airplanes open the oil drain valve by pushing the center of the drain up and turning counterclockwise." Actually sounds like it is tool-less and should lock open on it's own. Can't really try that out until your next oil change I suppose :)
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Interesting! Last time I participated in an oil change the A&P used a hose that he just sort of pushed up against it, it had no adapter on the end. Then he held it in place pushing the hose against the drain for a long time make sure it all got out. He has said that if I'd had a spare adapter he could have just used that and then walked away and let it drain itself...

It so happens that I'm due for an oil change right away!
 
Ryan Klems said:
I've actually not seen one of these valves in person, so I was just presuming there was a tool, and I've been a bit surprised to not see the tool called out separately, as one would guess that it would be easy to lose and need replacing. Reading the maintenance manual for aircraft that came originally with that quick drain I see this "Remove the engine cowl and on PA-28R-201 airplanes open the oil drain valve by pushing the center of the drain up and turning counterclockwise." Actually sounds like it is tool-less and should lock open on it's own. Can't really try that out until your next oil change I suppose :)
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When I had an arrow, turning wouldn't work, the tools (my mechanic and I tried several different types) wouldn't work, which left two choices: holding a hose until your arm felt like it was going to fall off, or, suction out the oil with something like this (guess which one I used):


upload_2022-6-24_16-59-10.png
I sold the arrow many years ago, but anybody want to buy a used oil extraction tank?
 
Took this picture of my buddys arrow last night. It looks like the F50 valve? Looks like the fitting to drain it is about 20 bucks like said in above post? He does not have the drain fitting since he recently bought it. I am going to order one to see if it fits and works.
This valve does not look like the one Tom Wells posted, am I right?

I did not see a screw on cap listed for when flying the plane?
https://www.aircraftspruce.com/pages/ep/oilsystems_oildrain/saf_airF62.php

IMG_1867.JPG
 
The cap isn’t sold separately for the Saf-Air drain but comes with the unit. The drain attachment comes with it too, but are also sold separately. You could likely get Saf-Air to sell you the cap though.
 
Ryan Klems said:
McFarlane and AirPower both sell the CCA-38001 tool < $20. I can't guarantee it'll work with the piper valve, but the CCB-38000 is a copy of that valve, so it's a shot. I sent piper tech support an email to see if they'll send along the P/N for the activation tool for the 492-172 valve, to see if it's available separately.
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20240121_151353.jpg
Hello. I was wondering if Piper sent the part number to you for the low profile oil drain probe. I too am the lucky owner of a Lycoming on an Arrow IV. When I relocated my plane suddenly nobody knows how to lock this 492-172V open. I ordered the Curtiss 38001, but I do not think it will work and it is on back order indefinitely. The Curtiss 38000 is actually different in that the 492-172 has the center tube slightly protruding with the bottom row of the hose barbs exposed. Any help or info would be greatly appreciated.
 
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Yeah, I had been mixed up before. That valve is toolless, should just be able to push up and twist counterclockwise to lock it open.
 
Ryan Klems said:
Yeah, I had been mixed up before. That valve is toolless, should just be able to push up and twist counterclockwise to lock it open.
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Thanks. Tried that, as well as clockwise, but it never locked open. Is it a finesse trick? Did I push too far up? Any idea if it is a quarter turn twist, half turn, etc?
 
IMG_8600.jpeg

Here’s mine, very easy and I can connect a hose to guide the oil where I want it to empty to.
 
Jp_Arrow said:
Thanks. Tried that, as well as clockwise, but it never locked open. Is it a finesse trick? Did I push too far up? Any idea if it is a quarter turn twist, half turn, etc?
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I have the same one in my Piper Arrow II (judging by the photo) and it does not lock open. The A&Ps that have changed my oil have all drained it pretty manually... And I've continued the tradition.
 
You can see the tracks that lock it in the pic above. Push in a bit less than a quarter turn counter-clockwise. Having said that, it doesn't look like an Arrow drain, unless the redish tube sticking out of it is removable. The issue with the Arrow is gear retraction will push in the normal Cherokee oil drain and nicely drain your oil as you fly along.
 
Hang 4 said:
You can see the tracks that lock it in the pic above. Push in a bit less than a quarter turn counter-clockwise. Having said that, it doesn't look like an Arrow drain, unless the redish tube sticking out of it is removable. The issue with the Arrow is gear retraction will push in the normal Cherokee oil drain and nicely drain your oil as you fly along.
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Look a few threads above that last Pic for the low-profile quick drain on the Arrow. Arrow needs low profile so tge retracting nose gear does not hold the valve open or punch it through the oil pan.
 

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Seems to me that your "quick" drain is more trouble than it is worth. Have you considered replacing it with a standard (non-quick, screw in) drain plug?
 
flyingbrit said:
Seems to me that your "quick" drain is more trouble than it is worth. Have you considered replacing it with a standard (non-quick, screw in) drain plug?
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No trouble for me. I like the original and approved equipment. Just trying to find the proper tool or technique. These low profile valves are required on the Arrow IV since it has retract gear and the nose wheel will cause problems with the valve if it is not the approved type.
 
flyingbrit said:
Seems to me that your "quick" drain is more trouble than it is worth. Have you considered replacing it with a standard (non-quick, screw in) drain plug?
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This one will also screw out and back in, of course, but then safety wire is an additional task everytime. Also, I would be concerned about the threads on the engine side with the frequency of 50 hour oil changes. Seems like that would be a more expensive option in the long run.
 
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