Requesting climb over airport

Jim K

Jim K

Final Approach
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Richard Digits
If all goes according to plan, @NealRomeoGolf is giving me a ride to retrieve 35E from KSUS tomorrow. It's under the 3000' STL bravo shelf, but not in the arrival path to KSTL.

The plane is just out of being worked on following a precautionary landing due to engine trouble. I'm not 100% convinced that they found the cause, but she's going to have to be flown as ground runs are showing no issue. Because of this I'd like to gain some altitude before leaving the airport environment.

I'm planning to file an airport to airport route that will keep me within about 25 miles of an airport all the way home. My first thought was to request a VCOA to 11000 in the remarks section. Of course the chances of there being no clouds that high are slim, so maybe putting KSUS or another nearby fix as my first waypoint and request climb-in-hold? Any better ideas?
 
When you call up CD/Ground explain what you want.
 
Jim K said:
If all goes according to plan, @NealRomeoGolf is giving me a ride to retrieve 35E from KSUS tomorrow. It's under the 3000' STL bravo shelf, but not in the arrival path to KSTL.

The plane is just out of being worked on following a precautionary landing due to engine trouble. I'm not 100% convinced that they found the cause, but she's going to have to be flown as ground runs are showing no issue. Because of this I'd like to gain some altitude before leaving the airport environment.

I'm planning to file an airport to airport route that will keep me within about 25 miles of an airport all the way home. My first thought was to request a VCOA to 11000 in the remarks section. Of course the chances of there being no clouds that high are slim, so maybe putting KSUS or another nearby fix as my first waypoint and request climb-in-hold? Any better ideas?
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If you are filing IFR don't worry about it, they will put you where they need you. If you are flying VFR, what I like to do is get FF on the ground if leaving a towered airport and they do that, or I pickup FF as soon as I can and ask for a bravo clearance and what ever else you want.

As far as the VCOA, tell the guy giving you your clearance what you want as EDFRED just wrote, make sure to tell him why.
 
declare an emergency on the ground (don't forget your hat!)


but also, just west of the field and still well within reach of the delta you have up to 5k to play with. why not a few in the pattern first, then climb up a bit and do your checks within a few miles of the field, then go home?
 
eman1200 said:
declare an emergency on the ground (don't forget your hat!)


but also, just west of the field and still well within reach of the delta you have up to 5k to play with. why not a few in the pattern first, then climb up a bit and do your checks within a few miles of the field, then go home?
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I'm definitely wearing the hat. Pink or red is the question.

I know it sounds overly cautious, but on the last flight, the run-up was perfect and everything was fine for about 30-40 minutes, so I'd like to stay within glide range of an airport all the way home. Even light, the lance has the glide ratio of an elephant (Jumbo, not Dumbo), so at 11K there will still be times that making an airport will be questionable.

I'm not too worried about STL approach, they issue bravo clearances like Eman hands out fireworks... whether you ask for them or not.... so I don't think they'll have a problem. I'm mainly trying to figure out how to file it and communicate it so everyone involved knows what I want to do. I'd like to get as far away from the ground as possible as quickly as possible while not confusing the controllers.
 
Every Bravo is different so that will change what you do. As eman suggested, I would do a few laps around the departure airport before venturing off. You can file an ifr flight plan and call them on the ground to get your clearance and explain the situation if you need something different than they give you. I think I've been cleared into the CLT Bravo once in my life even when I requested directly over the field at 8-10k doing 230 knts.
 
It just occurred to me that I probably won't get "as filed" like I usually do. Looks like 95% of the planes going sus-cmi get sent via spi, which creates a long stretch with no options.
 
Jim K said:
If all goes according to plan, @NealRomeoGolf is giving me a ride to retrieve 35E from KSUS tomorrow. It's under the 3000' STL bravo shelf, but not in the arrival path to KSTL.

The plane is just out of being worked on following a precautionary landing due to engine trouble. I'm not 100% convinced that they found the cause, but she's going to have to be flown as ground runs are showing no issue. Because of this I'd like to gain some altitude before leaving the airport environment.

I'm planning to file an airport to airport route that will keep me within about 25 miles of an airport all the way home. My first thought was to request a VCOA to 11000 in the remarks section. Of course the chances of there being no clouds that high are slim, so maybe putting KSUS or another nearby fix as my first waypoint and request climb-in-hold? Any better ideas?
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Get the Towers phone number. You should be able to find it. It’s likely the FBO’s on the field will have it. Likely you can just do some googling and find it. Call them and tell them what your plans are and what you need.
 
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eman1200 said:
declare an emergency on the ground (don't forget your hat!)


but also, just west of the field and still well within reach of the delta you have up to 5k to play with. why not a few in the pattern first, then climb up a bit and do your checks within a few miles of the field, then go home?
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In kinda a way, declaring on the ground before departing is what it is.
 
Have a safe flight. Make sure there’s plenty of highway and/or corn/beans between your AOG and base, if distances b/t airports is too great.
 
I think if you ask they will clear you pretty much how you want. You'll likely get an altitude restriction from tower until you get up with STL approach.

PS you could ask for a viking departure, but I think that only applies out of STL.
 
luvflyin said:
Highways and Corn have been getting enough action lately. Go for the Beans.
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Ewww, no. Bean vines are very tough and they’ll grab the gear and hang on. You will have the shortest landing ever.
 
keen9 said:
you could ask for a viking departure
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Had to look that one up; not sure I have the performance :D

bflynn said:
Ewww, no. Bean vines are very tough and they’ll grab the gear and hang on. You will have the shortest landing ever.
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I would've said the same thing, but Dan gryder's crash makes me think twice. I'm thinking you'd be less likely to flip in beans, although they'd probably rip the gear off. I'd be inclined to go in gear up either way.

So I filed my preferred route... of course the computer spit back "dct spi dct". I've never negotiated with clearance delivery before. I guess I just tell them what I want and they coordinate it with approach? (Or say "no") I don't believe they can see what I filed, so we're starting from scratch, right?
 
eman1200 said:
Why not a few in the pattern first, then climb up a bit and do your checks within a few miles of the field, then go home?
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You don't need to be as obsessive as I was breaking in a new engine but I'd sure agree 15 minutes of overhead the field would make you feel better. Tower and Approach were very understanding.

apfhcjU.png
 
Pugs said:
You don't need to be as obsessive as I was breaking in a new engine but I'd sure agree 15 minutes of overhead the field would make you feel better. Tower and Approach were very understanding...
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haha, looks like a plate of green spaghetti
 
Since you have to test it out anyway, can’t you venture West, away from the Bravo, then towards CMI with alternates along the way? I’d just get away from the busy airspace, climb, then keep diverts nearby.

I had some engine concerns about a year ago, best I could tell a momentarily impeded fuel nozzle. I checked plugs, cleaned nozzles & sumped the heck out of the plane. After that I did a handful of mag checks and a fair amount of full power engine runs. I was sorta treating it like a rental, not that I would treat one with abuse.
8A26A78A-BB95-4D36-A843-F73DE9B8F32C.png
 
sourdough44 said:
Since you have to test it out anyway, can’t you venture West, away from the Bravo, then towards CMI with alternates along the way? I’d just get away from the busy airspace, climb, then keep diverts nearby.

I had some engine concerns about a year ago, best I could tell a momentarily impeded fuel nozzle. I checked plugs, cleaned nozzles & sumped the heck out of the plane. After that I did a handful of mag checks and a fair amount of full power engine runs. I was sorta treating it like a rental, not that I would treat one with abuse.
View attachment 99289
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Yeah, if they won't let me go up through the bravo, I'm thinking of going west, climbing, and going over. I suspect a climb over sus will be the least disruptive for the controllers.
 
Just climb to west and go around Bravo. I see an airport just to the west with a long runway. I’m not sure I’d bother with ATC, max flexibility.
 
I think you should do a zoom climb in one turn around the airport to 9k and then get direct. ;)
 
So...
I called C/D and told him I had an ifr on file but was requesting different routing. There were cb's in the area at ~3000', but as it happened it was clear directly over the airport, so I requested a "visual climb over the airport", then direct cmi, and explained that this was the first flight after some engine work. After a bit of confusion and back & forth he figured out what I wanted.

I took off and got switched to approach quickly. They wound up giving me vectors, but kept me in the vicinity of the airport and it worked out quite well. It helped that i was very light and she climbed better than 1000'/ minute.
 
sourdough44 said:
So it sorta checked out ok? Back to normal ops?
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Everything seemed totally normal. I'm not planning long trips or passengers though until I have a few more trouble free hours.

I'm also going to download the engine monitor and see if I can see anything in the data.
 
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