ILS but no LOC

Sure they exist. Not too many, though.

RIL ILS RWY 26 is one.

EDIT:
AST ILS RWY 26
LVK ILS RWY 25R
LWS ILS RWY 26

Not sure why the theme of westbound runway here...

If you need more, let me know.

And any ILS with CONVERGING, PRM, or SA CAT I, CAT II, CAT III in the title, but I imagine that's not what you're looking for.
 
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Need some clarification. Do you mean to say that the ILS approach plate does not have LOC minimums but it's ok that the airport also has a LOC approach? Or do you mean to say that the ILS approach does not have LOC minimums and the airport does not have a LOC approach?
 
asicer said:
Need some clarification. Do you mean to say that the ILS approach plate does not have LOC minimums but it's ok that the airport also has a LOC approach? Or do you mean to say that the ILS approach does not have LOC minimums and the airport does not have a LOC approach?
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Yes. If it has a separate LOC approach, that's fine. Just not the same plate.
 
RussR said:
Sure they exist. Not too many, though.

RIL ILS RWY 26 is one.

EDIT:
AST ILS RWY 26
LVK ILS RWY 25R
LWS ILS RWY 26

Not sure why the theme of westbound runway here...

If you need more, let me know.

And any ILS with CONVERGING, PRM, or SA CAT I, CAT II, CAT III in the title, but I imagine that's not what you're looking for.
Click to expand...

Those are perfect. It's a sub-discussion on one of the threads in that FB group we both frequent. It got me curious.
 
KPOC ILS 26L has no LOC mins. There is a separate chart, with some different fixes, if you need LOC only.

As mentioned, KVNY has no LOC mins and no RNAV approach. There is a GPS overlay on one of the VORs.
 
N1120A said:
As mentioned, KVNY has no LOC mins and no RNAV approach. There is a GPS overlay on one of the VORs.
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There is an LDA approach. What do you mean GPS overlay on one of the VORs?
 
flyingron said:
There is an LDA approach. What do you mean GPS overlay on one of the VORs?
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The LDA is off the KBUR localizer and basically 90 degrees offset..

By GPS overlay I mean that VNY actually used to have a published GPS overlay on one of the VOR approaches, something it no longer has.
 
Only in the junk pile. The list of published charts doesn't have it.
 
RussR said:
Sure they exist. Not too many, though.

RIL ILS RWY 26 is one.

EDIT:
AST ILS RWY 26
LVK ILS RWY 25R
LWS ILS RWY 26

Not sure why the theme of westbound runway here...

If you need more, let me know.

And any ILS with CONVERGING, PRM, or SA CAT I, CAT II, CAT III in the title, but I imagine that's not what you're looking for.
Click to expand...

Do you know of others that have a significant initial turn on the Missed Approach like the ILS 25R at LVK
 
RussR said:
The POC ILS 26L mentioned previously is like this.
HNL ILS 8R is like this too.
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POM has you climbing 1,000 feet before the significant turn because of terrain that parallels the airport just a mile, or so, south. Then, the significant turn to remain within SCT's Empire sector airspace.
 
aterpster said:
POM has you climbing 1,000 feet before the significant turn because of terrain that parallels the airport just a mile, or so, south. Then, the significant turn to remain within SCT's Empire sector airspace.
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Yes. I wasn't quite sure the focus of @luvflyin 's question.
 
RussR said:
Yes. I wasn't quite sure the focus of @luvflyin 's question.
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Missing early. All these Approaches have a Missed Approach that start with a climb to some altitude before turning. But if you must miss early things can get weird if you haven't made some provision yourself to identify a Missed Approach POINT. Saying it is DH is wrong. That's an altitude at which must miss if you don't see the runway and complete a safe landing. If say your Glideslope 'flags' a few miles out there, you are to far above to salvage the Approach or maybe ATC just says "Execute Missed Approach. It is simply absurd to say you must continue to DH before doing it. The AIM addresses thiss. If the Missed Approach has a turn, you must continue to the Missed Approach POINT before beginning those turns. Most, if not all, of these ILS without localizer only minimums leave you to figure it out yourself. They could a least put a Timing Table on them.
 
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RussR said:
The POC ILS 26L mentioned previously is like this.
HNL ILS 8R is like this too.
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The POC ILS turn is basically the ODP out of there, which I'm surprised isn't a SID by now, since you get it on every IFR departure. And like Wally said, you are paralleling terrain until about midway over Puddingstone.
 
luvflyin said:
Missing early. All these Approaches have a Missed Approach that start with a climb to some altitude before turning. But if you must miss early things can get weird if you haven't made some provision yourself to identify a Missed Approach POINT. Saying it is DH is wrong. That's an altitude at which must miss if you don't see the runway and complete a safe landing. If say your Glideslope 'flags' a few miles out there, you are to far above to salvage the Approach or maybe ATC just says "Execute Missed Approach. It is simply absurd to say you must continue to DH before doing it. The AIM addresses thiss. If the Missed Approach has a turn, you must continue to the Missed Approach POINT before beginning those turns. Most, if not all, of these ILS without localizer only minimums leave you to figure it out yourself. They could a least put a Timing Table on them.
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I suppose that you could watch to see when the localizer needle got real twitchy, but nowadays it would probably be easier to have a GPS set up to show when you passed over the airport.
 
N1120A said:
The POC ILS turn is basically the ODP out of there, which I'm surprised isn't a SID by now, since you get it on every IFR departure. And like Wally said, you are paralleling terrain until about midway over Puddingstone.
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Same with El Monte. The ODP is always issued as part of an IFR clearance.
 
Palmpilot said:
I suppose that you could watch to see when the localizer needle got real twitchy, but nowadays it would probably be easier to have a GPS set up to show when you passed over the airport.
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Of course having RNAV takes the mystery out of it. Some of these Approaches have nearby VOR's and DME that makes it pretty easy to 'roll your own' Missed Approach Point if you have the equipment.
 
luvflyin said:
Of course having RNAV takes the mystery out of it. Some of these Approaches have nearby VOR's and DME that makes it pretty easy to 'roll your own' Missed Approach Point if you have the equipment.
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And if the rental plane didn't happen to have RNAV and I needed to fly an ILS that didn't have a way to identify the MAP other than descending to DH on the localizer, I would make sure that my handheld GPS was turned on and set up. (An unexpected condition that prevented finding the MAP with the installed IFR-certified equipment would certainly qualify as an emergency condition sufficient to justify using uncertified equipment for that purpose, IMO.)
 
KSBP ILS Rwy 11 used to be on the same plate as the localizer, now they are separate plates.
 
aterpster said:
Same with El Monte. The ODP is always issued as part of an IFR clearance.
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That always seems to me to be almost more about airspace than the terrain specifically, though EMT has some. What I don't like is that the EMT ODP is harder to replicate in a GPS than the POC one, where you just turn to a heading of 130 to intercept the POM-PRADO leg of V363. They really should just publish these ODPs as RNAV SIDs, even if they keep the ODPs for non-RNAV aircraft.

JScarry said:
KSBP ILS Rwy 11 used to be on the same plate as the localizer, now they are separate plates.
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I think that is because they charted different altitudes at DOBRA and also a different angle (3 degrees on the ILS and 3.23 on the LOC).
 
N1120A said:
I think that is because they charted different altitudes at DOBRA and also a different angle (3 degrees on the ILS and 3.23 on the LOC).
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They also changed the MDAs and visibility. With HASBY it was 540' and is now 760'. Without HASBY is now 1180' and used to be 1040'. I presume it has something to do with rule changes at the FAA since there are no new obstacles in the path.

Even though they extended the runway, I think the TDZ remained the same and the extra length is for takeoffs and landings on that end.
 
JScarry said:
They also changed the MDAs and visibility. With HASBY it was 540' and is now 760'. Without HASBY is now 1180' and used to be 1040'. I presume it has something to do with rule changes at the FAA since there are no new obstacles in the path.

Even though they extended the runway, I think the TDZ remained the same and the extra length is for takeoffs and landings on that end.
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@aterpster would probably know why.

My guess is that the terrain around there is the major issue.
 
None of the three ILS approaches at PHNL list LOC minimums. Both ILS approaches to 4R (Y & Z) do have two different sets of Straight In Minimums, however, based on the minimum climb for the missed.
 
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