Pilots Subpoenaed in Sex Trafficking Case

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They'll either get a deal or plead the fifth.
 
Do pilots of large aircraft really know who's in the back? They should ask the flight attendant.
 
If they did any international flights, they will have the names and birth dates of all passengers. It would be pretty obvious if there were any minors without their parents on board.
 
Groundpounder said:
If they did any international flights, they will have the names and birth dates of all passengers. It would be pretty obvious if there were any minors without their parents on board.
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Is knowing and checking that part of the pilot’s responsibility??
 
weilke said:
They'll either get a deal or plead the fifth.
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I hope they tell everything they know. However, that won't reflect well on them. "Yep, I knowingly transported underage girls so my boss and his friends could sexually abuse them." Do you give people with that story "a deal"? Tough call...
 
benyflyguy said:
Is knowing and checking that part of the pilot’s responsibility??
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Responsibility? That is open to interpretation, but they would have had paperwork with full names and DOB's in their possession, and should have verified everyone's passport.
 
Groundpounder said:
Responsibility? That is open to interpretation, but they would have had paperwork with full names and DOB's in their possession, and should have verified everyone's passport.
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Seems like the type of guy that controlled a lot I imagine there was a “handler” that was with them harem at all time and someone removed ppl who didn’t need to know
 
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benyflyguy said:
Seems like the type of guy that controlled a lot I imagine there was a “handler” that was with them harem at all time and someone removed ppl who didn’t need to know
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I don't think you understand how corporate aviation and international operations work.
 
“I have no idea who I transport; my responsibility is to my boss, and he says fly point A to point B on this date and time. I have neither the responsibility nor the right to screen passengers except as it concerns the safety of flight. All I do is make sure the bus leaves on time and gets there safely. Anyone in the back is cargo as far as I’m concerned, I keep the cockpit door closed.”.
(I think that would apply for domestic flights, I have no knowledge of intl travel.)

edit: If I found myself working for someone unsavory, or involved in suspicious activity especially relating to use of the airplane, I am gone.
 
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Groundpounder said:
If they did any international flights, they will have the names and birth dates of all passengers. It would be pretty obvious if there were any minors without their parents on board.
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That sounds correct if they where law abiding people . But if they are underage what are the odds they listed all passengers .
 
Okay I think the point is being missed here. The referenced article doesn't say the pilots are being implicated as conspirators as far as I can tell, just being subpoenaed as potential material witnesses.
 
Sac Arrow said:
Okay I think the point is being missed here. The referenced article doesn't say the pilots are being implicated as conspirators as far as I can tell, just being subpoenaed as potential material witnesses.
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That's how I read the article as well.
 
I can't believe that they did not know what was going on. I know that we like and often defer to pilots but these ones need to go to jail.
 
Donny Hughes said:
That sounds correct if they where law abiding people . But if they are underage what are the odds they listed all passengers .
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If it was an international flight, the crew would have a gendec that has all pax listed with full names and DOB's. If anything is incorrect, and US Customs catches it, it falls on the PIC.

Domestic is a different story
 
Shepherd said:
I predict a "mass suicide" of pilots.
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I'm guessing this is a reference to the old "death list"?...

Its funny how these conspiracy theories seem to have a life of their own. But, common sense has got to be saying, "where there's that much smoke, there has to be some kind of fire." I wouldn't trust either of those two with the keys to my car, let alone the White House.
 
Sac Arrow said:
Okay I think the point is being missed here. The referenced article doesn't say the pilots are being implicated as conspirators as far as I can tell, just being subpoenaed as potential material witnesses.
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Anyone who talks to the feds has to know that he can go from 'witness' to 'defendant' in a very short amount of time. I would anticipate that these pilots go into the interviews with representation and there may well be proffer agreements involved before they comment on anything as innocent as the weather. Pilots have been held criminally responsible for drugs transported on their plane. You can claim that you didn't know what was in a duffle bag, it's difficult to claim that 'you didn't know' if there are multiple gendecs with your signature on them.
Someone famously joked that 'its nice that Epstein let's the neighborhood kids use his pool', what he did was apparently pretty blatant. Even though all this dates back a few decades, there may still be a risk to anyone involved in the activities.

Some of these pilots have already been deposed in the lawsuits surrounding this ugly story. I doubt they were surprised when the grand jury subpoena showed up. But hey, they can just say 'at this point, what difference does it make ?' and rely on the fact that 'they had no criminal intent'. That should do it ;-)
 
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weilke said:
Anyone who talks to the feds has to know that he can go from 'witness' to 'defendant' in a very short amount of time. I would anticipate that these pilots go into the interviews with representation and there may well be proffer agreements involved before they comment on anything as innocent as the weather. Pilots have been held criminally responsible for things like drugs transported on their plane. You can claim that you didn't know what was in a duffle bag, it's difficult to claim that 'you didn't know' if there are multiple gendecs with your signature on them. Someone famously joked that 'its nice that Epstein let's the neighborhood kids use his pool', what he did was apparently pretty blatant. Even though all this dates back a few decades, there may still be a risk to anyone involved in the activities.
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I do understand that. There is a video out on Youtube on how it is stupid to talk to cops, even if you are innocent.
 
"those bricks of colombian bam bam were already there when I cranked engines, I mean, she looked 18... your Honor...." :D

joking aside, CONUS to the USVI is domestic. However, colonialism vestiges as they are, CBP requires eAPIS for the flight from USVI->CONUS, while it does honor and considers CONUS->USVI as domestic, just like
CONUS->PR, PR->CONUS* (*that one requires USDA though, like Hawaii), or CONUS-CONUS. So for the outbounds out of USVI, yeah there would have been Customs shenanigans and that can get PICs in trouble on the paper trail front.

I wonder if "see no evil hear no evil say no evil no" will be a valid answer for the federales. LOL
 
hindsight2020 said:
joking aside, CONUS to the USVI is domestic. However, colonialism vestiges as they are, CBP requires eAPIS for the flight from USVI->CONUS, while it does honor and considers CONUS->USVI as domestic, just like
CONUS->PR, PR->CONUS* (*that one requires USDA though, like Hawaii), or CONUS-CONUS. So for the outbounds out of USVI, yeah there would have been Customs shenanigans and that can get PICs in trouble on the paper trail front.
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Epstein also had a home in Paris and there have been prior allegations that some of his procurement experts went to third countries to ensure an ongoing supply.
 
Groundpounder said:
If they did any international flights, they will have the names and birth dates of all passengers. It would be pretty obvious if there were any minors without their parents on board.
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Airlines carry minors internationally without parents everyday.
 
[QUOTE Arrow, post: 2766059, member: 7476"]I do understand that. There is a video out on Youtube on how it is stupid to talk to cops, even if you are innocent.[/QUOTE]

Yep, whats funny, is I only trust "real" Bikers, never trust any cop! Treat cops like bikers do, and I always call them "legalized gang members" always looking for easy score to generate revenue for their club, as well as mother chapters, this ****es them off as bad as anything, and I will say "prove me wrong"
 
Morgan3820 said:
I can't believe that they did not know what was going on. I know that we like and often defer to pilots but these ones need to go to jail.
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So you agree with the current trend of skipping any presumption of innocence and proceeding directly to guilt?
 
kyleb said:
I hope they tell everything they know. However, that won't reflect well on them. "Yep, I knowingly transported underage girls so my boss and his friends could sexually abuse them." Do you give people with that story "a deal"? Tough call...
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Depends on how badly they want to get the man at the top, I imagine.
 
Shepherd said:
I predict a "mass suicide" of pilots.
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LOL. Trying NOT to be political here, but I did TRY to track the case of the Hilary sysadmin who ran her mail server... and he of course never showed up for any but his first hearing and then disappeared.

I don’t think anything bad happened to him, but I always wondered where that sort of person finds a job after doing stuff like that. So I tried to find out.

Wouldn’t matter political affiliation or anything, we wouldn’t hire a sysadmin who knowingly broke the law. Sysadmins have a ton of necessary access to critical stuff and the vast majority of us don’t WANT anyone’s passwords or ability to read their email, but frankly if you run the server, you’re going to unless they encrypt everything.

And then there’s the days when someone’s disgruntled ex sends nudie pictures of some employee to an external mailing list address and you gotta go delete all that crap from all accounts and hand over copies to the cops... sigh.

Or even stupider stuff like a doctor enjoying hours and hours of porn on his hospital provided computer and internet connection. (Not me, but a friend got to handle that one... guess what job you lose for a good long while when you’re a registered sex offender... let’s just say you’re not seeing patients in private anymore once you find some place willing to hire you...)

Dumbassery abounds.

Anyway. Haven’t checked in a while but the sysadmin guy disappeared. I hope for doing that they gave him a nice salary doing nothing and a beach condo somewhere. Otherwise it wouldn’t be worth it.

Doing the dirty work of untouchables had better be damned lucrative... is all I’m sayin’. And when they’re not charged and you are...

No thanks. Anyone wants to do illegal crap on my servers, I’m out.
 
3393RP said:
So you agree with the current trend of skipping any presumption of innocence and proceeding directly to guilt?
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I think that the term ‘red handed’ applies. Can you conceive of a scenario where the pilots, over years of flying for Epstein, were unaware of what was going on?
But you are correct. I will rephrase.
If found guilty in a court of law, the pilots need to go to jail. PIC-Pilot in Charge.
 
old_biker said:
[QUOTE Arrow, post: 2766059, member: 7476"]I do understand that. There is a video out on Youtube on how it is stupid to talk to cops, even if you are innocent.
Click to expand...

Yep, whats funny, is I only trust "real" Bikers, never trust any cop! Treat cops like bikers do, and I always call them "legalized gang members" always looking for easy score to generate revenue for their club, as well as mother chapters, this ****es them off as bad as anything, and I will say "prove me wrong"[/QUOTE]

I call them the ‘Armed Revenue Service’, opposed to the Revenue Service.
 
Sac Arrow said:
Okay I think the point is being missed here. The referenced article doesn't say the pilots are being implicated as conspirators as far as I can tell, just being subpoenaed as potential material witnesses.
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In that case expect to hear a lot of this

14uqp2.jpg
 
Palmpilot said:
Sounds like a good way to become a defendant.
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Which is better always than saying something without your lawyer knowing you’ll be saying it.

After that, you’ll usually get as much justice as you can afford. Here’s hoping they didn’t bother to save up a rainy day fund if they knew what was coming someday and they have awful attorneys. LOL. :)
 
Doing as the Schultz cartoon suggests would likely require lying, which is itself an offense. I would expect even a second-rate lawyer to warn them about the perils of doing that (e.g., what happened to Martha Stewart.) Since the prosecutors are trying to get information from the pilots, it seems like they might get offered some kind of deal in order to get their cooperation.
 
denverpilot said:
LOL. Trying NOT to be political here, but I did TRY to track the case of the Hilary sysadmin who ran her mail server... and he of course never showed up for any but his first hearing and then disappeared.

I don’t think anything bad happened to him, but I always wondered where that sort of person finds a job after doing stuff like that. So I tried to find out.

Wouldn’t matter political affiliation or anything, we wouldn’t hire a sysadmin who knowingly broke the law. Sysadmins have a ton of necessary access to critical stuff and the vast majority of us don’t WANT anyone’s passwords or ability to read their email, but frankly if you run the server, you’re going to unless they encrypt everything.

And then there’s the days when someone’s disgruntled ex sends nudie pictures of some employee to an external mailing list address and you gotta go delete all that crap from all accounts and hand over copies to the cops... sigh.

Or even stupider stuff like a doctor enjoying hours and hours of porn on his hospital provided computer and internet connection. (Not me, but a friend got to handle that one... guess what job you lose for a good long while when you’re a registered sex offender... let’s just say you’re not seeing patients in private anymore once you find some place willing to hire you...)

Dumbassery abounds.

Anyway. Haven’t checked in a while but the sysadmin guy disappeared. I hope for doing that they gave him a nice salary doing nothing and a beach condo somewhere. Otherwise it wouldn’t be worth it.

Doing the dirty work of untouchables had better be damned lucrative... is all I’m sayin’. And when they’re not charged and you are...

No thanks. Anyone wants to do illegal crap on my servers, I’m out.
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“Not trying to be political here, but here’s an anti-Hillary rant!” And of course it stands.
 
"Rant" is in the same category as "hater". Both words apply to any objection or observation, no matter how mild, that's contrary to the opinion of the person applying the label.
 
3393RP said:
"Rant" is in the same category as "hater". Both words apply to any objection or observation, no matter how mild, that's contrary to the opinion of the person applying the label.
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Ranting hater!



Just kidding. I actually agree.
 
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