My mission, any others compared to Cessna 182 and Piper 235/Dakota?

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rowdog_14

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rowdog_14
I have narrowed my plane choice down to two planes but is there any more comparable for my mission and wants. I have searched and searched. Read forum post after forum post.

- Any other plan I am missing that will be like the 182 and the Piper 235/Dakota as a fixed gear?

What I am looking for in a plane/Mission

- Wife wants an almost one and done plane. One that we can keep at least 10 years and not have to worry about anything performance wise.
- 4-seater for growing family, currently 9 and 7 years old, all together we weigh about 500 lbs now
- Looking at a lot of 200nm trips to visit family with a few 5 – 6hr trips (2/2.5 stops) throughout the year.

- Useful load of about 1100-1200 +
- Get about 10-12 GPH maybe a little more.
- Taking about 100-150lbs of luggage.
- Would like 180hp +
- Cruise about 120-130kts+
- Fixed Gear
- Not too hung up on Low or High wing
- Looking at a 70’s – mid 80’s model maybe newer
- No kit planes :( (wife not interested)
- Price...I have an open budget, but do have a unique range.

Other considerations –

- I would like two doors because of family but not a deal breaker
- Would like a high wing only because of checking fuel sumps as I get older , and possibly doing some off-airport camping trips (but not fully sure on this). Plus, a low wing should do fine as long as I go to a nice low-cut field and not a full bush area .

Currently planes I have looked at

These will work for now but within about 2-5 years I am going to be out of useful load even cutting the fuel down ☹

- Cessna 177 180HP model non-RG version
- Archer I/II
- CHEROKEE 180
- Grumman Tiger
- Beechcraft Sundowner

These should benefit me for years to come

- Cessna 182 – Love this plane just wish it had the look of the Dakota
- 235/Dakota – Love this plane just wish it had the functionality of the 182
- Cherokee 6 – This is my runner up to the 182 and Dakota
- Vans RV10 – I love this but wife is not sold on a kit plane so it is totally out
- Any other plan I am missing that will be like the 182 and the Piper 235/Dakota as a fixed gear?


Thanks
 
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A Dakota and a 182 will do that mission with equal aplomb. If you're willing to consider a Cherokee 6, you should also think about a Cessna 206, but neither will be available for $60k.

People will come along any minute now, saying you need to consider this weird orphan or that antique, but the 182 and 235 are your real-world options with fixed gear.

Personally, I think this is perfect for an A36 Bonanza, but you asked about fixed gear and you won't find one in your price range.
 
Yeah I love the A36, and the Lance/Saratoga. I even like the Beech Sierra because it has two doors and is a low wing, but all are retracts. I looked at the 206 but saw the price and was like nope :) Not that I am against retracts, I love them...just do not want that extra concern right now or maintenance. Probably in the future.

Thanks for the feedback. Just want to make sure I have not missed any fixed gear options that compare to the 182 and 235.
 
I started this thread about a week ago giving my comparison from our 182(PIC/Owner) to Dakota(as a passenger). I would recommend reading all the posts in this thread as both sides are pretty well represented.

https://www.pilotsofamerica.com/community/threads/dakota-vs-skylane-first-impressions.119914/

I believe your airplane capability to cost ratio will favor the Piper 235's as 182's are kinda spendy these days. We really like the 182...but then again I haven't flown in a TTx or 210 yet :)
 
I think the OP's budget is a bit low. He may find one in that price range but it may be one from the early or mid 60s. The Skylane in particular is a perennial favorite and Cessna's production of new ones over the last 10 years has been tapering off to hardly anything.
 
The budget is just a ball figure right now. I have noticed most Dakotas and 182 going for 80k - 100k, that have everything I want. So not set in stone. Budget aside...am I missing anything in this same or similar class to the 182/235 fixed gear other than the Cherokee 6?
 
Sorry, but you won't find a Dakota for anywhere near $60K. I paid twice that for mine, and they have increased in price since then. It's a great traveling machine and will carry anything you can put in it, but you'll have to live with one door. The low wing makes fueling it much easier and sumping fuel is not that difficult under the wing.
 
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FormerHangie said:
Which one has that amount of load carrying ability?
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I have no clue but there was a thread on here fairly recently where a Maule (I think a now wheel variant???) was being compared to the 182 and since the OP wants to make sure hes looked all similar aircraft I thought I would mention it. Was hoping the same Maule owners would jump in.
 
Removed the Price point. Just do not want people getting hung up on that, but yes I know it is important. I understand both the 182/Dakota can not be had for $50-60k unless I get something that will need work. Even older 182 and 235 possibly. My main concern is am I on point with these being my only options that fit my mission outside of the Piper 6.

I am thinking I have narrowed it down pretty good to the right planes. Just want to confirm
 
Thanks @Mtns2Skies! Maybe that gives the OP a few more alternatives.

And just you answering....duh....the OP can also include 180's as he didn't specify tricycle gear only.
 
I did look into the Maule's but one do not like the look :( and I was not able to find any with the useful load needed. Most hit right at 1000 or less.
 
Beech Super Musketeers (A23-24, 200hp) can have seriously good useful loads. Ours was 1,300 pounds. They're sort of a sleeper in the market and get lumped in with Sundowners and the older Musketeers, which is a shame.

They're older than the Sundowners, but in my opinion, better. (and my first plane was a Sundowner). They can even be found in the rare 2-door variant. About 125kt can be expected, 130 if it's cold or you're light.
 
Sinistar said:
the OP can also include 180's as he didn't specify tricycle gear only.
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Thanks I did not look into the 180 is has a load of around 1200. That is at the bottom of my range but i can deal with that.
 
schmookeeg said:
Beech Super Musketeers (A23-24, 200hp) can have seriously good useful loads. Ours was 1,300 pounds. They're sort of a sleeper in the market and get lumped in with Sundowners and the older Musketeers, which is a shame.

They're older than the Sundowners, but in my opinion, better. (and my first plane was a Sundowner). They can even be found in the rare 2-door variant. About 125kt can be expected, 130 if it's cold or you're light.
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Yeah that is one I looked at too. I do not know why I did not include that. I actually went and looked at one last month. There is a guy that has one about an hour from me. Thanks for the reminder.
 
rowdog_14 said:
Yeah that is one I looked at too. I do not know why I did not include that. I actually went and looked at one last month. There is a guy that has one about an hour from me. Thanks for the reminder.
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They're eminently forgettable and dowdy things. :D Built like a brick outhouse, land like one too -- they demand more precision of airspeed on final than other trainer types, and have a reputation for porpoising on landing if you get slow. A blip of power smooths everything out -- failure to blip the power can see a nosegear collapse if you don't fix it by the third bounce.

I think we paid 30k for ours and sold it for the same. There is an active type club, and there is only one item of "unobtanium" that I know of, which is the exhaust downtubes. (1 5/8", no longer made) We 337'd a Beech Sierra exhaust (1 3/4", common as heck) onto ours and did some clever rearranging under the cowl to accomodate. The fuel injection makes it stone simple to operate. Throttle in, go up. Throttle out, go down. Like flying the Disneyland dumbo ride. Definitely worth a test flight if you can find one.
 
Only thing I found is they are hard to come by especially the two door. What got me looking at those was a direct friend of mine has a Sierra and he told me about those and I fell in love with it when I saw the two doors.
 
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Too bad that the RV-10 is off the list - it would meet your mission well. I just got back on a trip from Georgia -> Colorado -> South Dakota -> Iowa -> Georgia. I never had a cruise groundspeed <160kts (actually had sustained >200kts enroute to IA) and fuel burn was right at 12gph (I have one cylinder that is preventing me from going LOP and getting 150-155kts on 10gph). We did the trip with all 4 seats filled with nearly identical size as your family, roughly 100-125lbs luggage, and full fuel. We took off out of Fort Collins with a DA of 7800' and were off the ground in <1000ft and climbed out at 100kts and >500fpm. For fun, I let the autopilot shoot a couple of fully coupled GPS approaches to minimums as I monitored things on the two full-size MFDs with full engine performance monitoring inline.

My wife has ridden in everything from C-172, C177RG, Cheorkee 6-300, and C182RG. If asked which plane she preferred for travelling, it would be the -10 without any bit of hesitation.
 
Both are good options. Personally I'd favor the 182 for the two doors, which is one of the reasons I like the SR22 for us.

If you are traveling frequently you'll want to make sure you have the right avionics for IFR flights; and hopefully an IR not too far down the road. Yeah, you can travel VFR, but IFR really helps. I'm in Atlanta too. When I got my PPL I thought I'd wait a year or so to start my IR. A few cancellations for some rather benign IFR weather and I started it in two months. It's a lot cheaper to buy the avionics in the plane than to install them later. Although many of the new options are bringing those costs differences closer together.
 
You might want to check out the Rockwell Commander 114. It's roomy, comfortable, built like you'd expect a defense contractor to build a plane (check out the carrier-landing gear!), two-doors and a ton of ramp presence. They might be better value than either the 182 or Dakotas now. The Commander type club does an excellent job sourcing parts and such to keeping these flying.

The only thing I am not sure about is whether the useful load will meet your needs. No idea what sort of empty weights the used ones are running these days, but with a 260 hp IO-540 Lycoming it should carry at least 1200 lbs.
 
I’m new here(first post actually) but am in the same boat(not really a boat, wrong forum for that). I started looking for Cherokee 6s and then got researching. There are fixed gear Saratoga’s available and there is one on Controller now for close to your original price point. It did come from another country so the logs were translated but the price reflects that if a good pre-buy is done. Happy hunting, I ended up deciding I want retracts so my options expanded a bit.
 
Nick Pilotte said:
There are fixed gear Saratoga’s available
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rowdog_14 said:
Never knew that. I thought those were all retracts. Will need to look into that
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Yep - 1980 to 1986 or so - basically a Cherokee Six 300 with tapered wings. Normally-aspirated and turbocharged available. In the terminology of the day the fixed-gear was "Saratoga" and the retractable was "Saratoga SP".

359D03F9-3CD8-4540-AEC0-FFC13C093479.jpeg
 
I just looked them up and that is nice! I will add that to my list. The one thing I did not like about the 6 was its age and having a fixed gear Saratoga great! Thanks!
 
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