Used Engines

[bnt83]

I hope you gat back in the air soon with an acceptable resolution.

 

[Grum.Man]

I have to tell you, I think you've got a winner either way, but i'd sure be tempted to hang the engine and fly it in low risk scenarios for 5 hours or so (over airports, high over easy landing terrain in day vfr, maybe even doing an oil change at 5 hours and see if you really even need to spend the 10k.

If he could see the accident airplane that might be an acceptable risk. IMO without seeing the condition of the accident airplane and how it crashed I would not take this risk. I suppose if you dial the prop flange and it is true I might. If you lose a propeller, the vibration could tear the engine from the mounts and you will have no control over the airplane. I realize this is dooms day scenario but the op should be fully informed. If the flange is straight and a good bore scope inspection of the cylinders and accessory case doesn't reveal any issues then I might possibly take the chance as well.

 

[MIFlyer]

If he could see the accident airplane that might be an acceptable risk. IMO without seeing the condition of the accident airplane and how it crashed I would not take this risk. I suppose if you dial the prop flange and it is true I might. If you lose a propeller, the vibration could tear the engine from the mounts and you will have no control over the airplane. I realize this is dooms day scenario but the op should be fully informed. If the flange is straight and a good bore scope inspection of the cylinders and accessory case doesn't reveal any issues then I might possibly take the chance as well.

I don't think you're wrong, especially with what we don't know about the airplane. Before you spend 10k, it might be worth hunting down some accident photos or photos of how that plane sits today in the junkyard. you could possibly find the junkyard it's in by looking at the NTSB report to see where it crashed, calling nearby aircraft salvage yards (or contacting the old owner) and then having the junkyard guy snap a few photos if it hasn't been cut up yet.

just a wild idea

 

[Tom-D]

I agree that would definitely be a concern. In this case however, the overhaul report indicates the rod and main bearings are all "STD", which I'm assuming means they didn't have to turn the journals, and theoretically they should only have 17 hours of wear on them. Even if the original overhaul shop was a little liberal with the clearances and they do need to be turned, they shouldn't be beyond limits, and even if they are, Wentworth says they'll replace the crank so I'm cautiously optimistic.

The engine has 17 hours on it? GO FOR IT.

Who did the overhaul?

 

[bnt83]

All the bickering aside, if you're going be buying an engine outright, NOW is the time to ditch the dual mag A1F6D. In fact, I WOULD NOT hang another one on of those on it if it were my airplane.

That becomes a question of which engines are already approved and will the prop work.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

The engine has 17 hours on it? GO FOR IT.

Who did the overhaul?

See below, already posted.

Thanks for the input so far, it's really helpful!

More info: Turns out the Wentworth engine is a prop strike. (Landed in a corn field after apparent fuel exhaustion) Not a deal breaker but not as ideal as I was hoping. At least if I go with this engine I'll "know" what's inside after the inspection. Factory new cylinders and overhauled by Signature Aircraft Engines Oct 2016.

Anyone have any feedback on Signature Aircraft engines or the cost of a prop strike inspection?

 

[Dbarbee]

I have to tell you, I think you've got a winner either way, but i'd sure be tempted to hang the engine and fly it in low risk scenarios for 5 hours or so (over airports, high over easy landing terrain in day vfr, maybe even doing an oil change at 5 hours and see if you really even need to spend the 10k.

I can't say the thought didn't cross my mind. At the end of the day though I would end up kicking myself if I had to pull the engine again for something that I could have caught with an inspection. (and I have no desire to repeat a dead stick landing at night ever again!) Obviously doing the inspection is no guarantee that nothing will happen later but at least I'll have the peace of mind of knowing I did all I could do.

I hope you gat back in the air soon with an acceptable resolution.

Thanks!! This entire event has thoroughly reminded me how much I hate renting airplanes.

...Before you spend 10k, it might be worth hunting down some accident photos or photos of how that plane sits today in the junkyard. you could possibly find the junkyard it's in by looking at the NTSB report to see where it crashed, calling nearby aircraft salvage yards (or contacting the old owner) and then having the junkyard guy snap a few photos if it hasn't been cut up yet.

just a wild idea

As I mentioned in a previous post, Wentworth sent me pictures of the airplane and the engine and I read the NTSB report. The NTSB report only says that the right wing spar was bent and the fuselage behind the cabin was wrinkled and there's no mention of it flipping over inverted. The pictures show a bent nose wheel fork and slightly bent prop blade but other than that the airframe looks undamaged. (Unable to see the wrinkles mentioned in the NTSB report)

As much as I'd like to save another $10,000, and as unlikely as it is that there's anything wrong with the engine, I'm just not willing to take that risk, especially after what we've been through so far. Having to pull the engine again could easily eat up $10,000 or more.

 

[Bill]

All the bickering aside, if you're going be buying an engine outright, NOW is the time to ditch the dual mag A1F6D. In fact, I WOULD NOT hang another one on of those on it if it were my airplane.

That is one of the big reasons we went with a Lyco factory overhaul on the Mooney, we switched from the A3B6D to the A3B6 and also went to roller tappets.

 

[Dbarbee]

All the bickering aside, if you're going be buying an engine outright, NOW is the time to ditch the dual mag A1F6D. In fact, I WOULD NOT hang another one on of those on it if it were my airplane.

That becomes a question of which engines are already approved and will the prop work.

That is very good advice and was strongly recommended by the folks on the Cardinal Flyers Online digest too. I thoroughly researched that option and even talked to my A&P I/A about it. (He was onboard with the conversion) It's not economically viable to actually convert an A1F6D to the non-D because it requires a different accessory case and governor and a change to the crankshaft gear. It is however a minimal cost difference to exchange an A1F6D for an overhauled A1F6. There are still some minor modifications that have to be done but both engines are on the type certificate and approved for use with my prop. The problem is, I don't have an engine to exchange and would have to purchase outright from Lycoming (way beyond my budget) or find an A1F6 core to overhaul or exchange, and there's not a lot of them out there.

The reality for me is that the potential of being down for many more months looking for an engine &/or spending another $20,000-$30,000 just didn't outweigh the potential benefit of getting rid of the dual mag. YMMV

 

[bnt83]

Keep looking for used engines, non-A1F6D engines