Denied Medical or Application Withdrawn?

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Medical Renewal

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So I'm due for a renewal of my 3rd class medical in the next few months and I am looking at upgrading to a 2nd or even 1st class medical anyway (still under 40 so might as well try to get the first class if I can).

My question is regarding question 13 on the 8500-8 MedXpress form. Has Your FAA Airman Medical Certificate Ever Been Denied, Suspended, or Revoked?

I went for my first 3rd class medical in September 2009 and received a deferral from the AME. I I am fairly sure I did not contact the FAA in writing at that time but it's been 10 years so I dont really recall but I do know the FAA sent me a letter requesting additional information regarding information listed on my application with a set timeline (some number of days). I also know I contacted the FAA once by phone to discuss what information they required since the letter was rather vague and after the laundry list of things the FAA demanded, I decided not to pursue it further and never sent the information in.

I recall receiving a second letter but dont recall whether the letter stated my medical had been denied or if it was more of a "non-issuance/withdrawn."

In 2011, I finally decided to pursue my medical again. I contacted the FAA by phone to find out what the process would be and was informed my previous medical information was still on file and still valid if I wished to complete it. They informed me all it would take was a letter from my PCP explaining the circumstances and any recurrence around an ailment I had 13 years (in 2011; 11 years in 2009) prior and some other minutiae.

I got the letter as requested, sent it to the FAA and a few months later, I received my unrestricted 3rd class medical with an expiration date of 9/30/2014 based on my exam date of 9/2009.

When I renewed my medical in 2014, I dont remember how I answered the question regarding denial but as I will be increasing my class this go around and therefore under more scrutiny, I want to make sure my medical is as accurate as possible... So that raises the question of what to do in 2019 when it comes time to answer the question "have you ever been denied a medical"

Reading the regs, 67.409 seems to indicate that since I did not contact the FAA in writing, that my application would be considered withdrawn but then my AME did not actually deny my medical instead deferring it to OKC. The fact that my original medical was considered valid without the need for additional medical exams (beyond a visit to my PCP for a letter) or costly specialists could point in either direction. As does the fact that when my medical was finally issued in early March/April 2012, it was issued with an issuance date of September 2009 and signed by the FAA representative.
 
One way to get the answer to your question of "what did the FAA have to say about my past applications?" Is to request a copy of your medical file from the FAA. Instructions to do that can be found here...


It takes 6-12 weeks to get the file. But what you do get is everything they have on you including all correspondence you sent to them and they sent to you. Also included is all of the 8500-8's complete with the info the AME added during the exam, all status letters and documentation you submitted at exam, and more.

All of this should not only ask the questions you posed above, but also assist in completing the new 8500-8 honestly and accurately.
 
The FAA does not withdraw applications. Once you failed to submit the required information, you were denied.
 
Sure sounds like a denial. That said, you’ve since gotten an unrestricted medical so it shouldn’t be an issue getting a new medical.
 
The FAA does not withdraw applications. Once you failed to submit the required information, you were denied.

67.409a would seem to disagree with you

Any person who is denied a medical certificate by an aviation medical examiner may, within 30 days after the date of the denial, apply in writing and in duplicate to the Federal Air Surgeon... ...for reconsideration of that denial. If the person does not ask for reconsideration during the 30-day period after the date of the denial, he or she is considered to have withdrawn the application for a medical certificate.

67.409(b)1 also says pretty much the same thing:
The denial of a medical certificate by an aviation medical examiner is not a denial by the Administrator under 49 U.S.C. 44703.

But both indicate the denial came from the AME which isn't really my situation.

One way to get the answer to your question of "what did the FAA have to say about my past applications?" Is to request a copy of your medical file from the FAA. Instructions to do that can be found here...


It takes 6-12 weeks to get the file. But what you do get is everything they have on you including all correspondence you sent to them and they sent to you. Also included is all of the 8500-8's complete with the info the AME added during the exam, all status letters and documentation you submitted at exam, and more.

All of this should not only ask the questions you posed above, but also assist in completing the new 8500-8 honestly and accurately.

Thanks for the information. I mailed my request for my airmen file to the FAA today.
 
67.409a would seem to disagree with you

Any person who is denied a medical certificate by an aviation medical examiner may, within 30 days after the date of the denial, apply in writing and in duplicate to the Federal Air Surgeon... ...for reconsideration of that denial. If the person does not ask for reconsideration during the 30-day period after the date of the denial, he or she is considered to have withdrawn the application for a medical certificate.

67.409(b)1 also says pretty much the same thing:
The denial of a medical certificate by an aviation medical examiner is not a denial by the Administrator under 49 U.S.C. 44703.

But both indicate the denial came from the AME which isn't really my situation.



Thanks for the information. I mailed my request for my airmen file to the FAA today.

If the AME does not immediately issue issue or deny, the decision is termed a DEFERRAL. The FAA response letters frequently request the pilot provide additional medical information to support the application. If no information is received at the end of the period, the FAA may deny the airman's medical certificate.
 
If the AME does not immediately issue issue or deny, the decision is termed a DEFERRAL. The FAA response letters frequently request the pilot provide additional medical information to support the application. If no information is received at the end of the period, the FAA may deny the airman's medical certificate.
...and if no certificate results, that is a DENIAL.
 
...and if no certificate results, that is a DENIAL.

My takeaway from this situation then is that if there is ever any question and the AME is leaning towards a deferral, push them for a denial, walk away for 30 days and try again.
 
My takeaway from this situation then is that if there is ever any question and the AME is leaning towards a deferral, push them for a denial, walk away for 30 days and try again.
And you expect the results to be different in 30 days?
 
My takeaway from this situation then is that if there is ever any question and the AME is leaning towards a deferral, push them for a denial, walk away for 30 days and try again.
You do NOT want a denial if at all possible.
 
And you expect the results to be different in 30 days?

Depends on why the AME is deferring. In the OPs case it doesnt sound like it was anything major since a letter from a PCP was sufficient for the FAA to issue the medical.

Im of course also reminded of the thread elsewhere on this forum about the AME who would call the FAA to warn them about certain pilots when the pilot decided to take their business elsewhere.
https://www.pilotsofamerica.com/community/threads/ame-contacted-the-faa-to-warn-them-about-me.94478/

Temporary ailments or even long term ones that one AME takes exception to while others dont also come to mind... from my own experience I had an AME defer and try to ground me over an issue listed as “as previously reported, no change in status” for a 3rd class medical renewal.

When I went to a different AME a few months later for an upgraded class, he didnt even bat an eyelash and it barely rated mention/discussion.

Considering the 1st AME wanted to immediately ground me and the FAA took somewhere around 3 months to respond, having that AME deny the application, not appealing it within 30 days thus withdrawing the application and enabling me to go to a different AME the following month (perhaps even better prepared with supporting documentationIn hand). I would have been grounded for 31 days vs 90 days.

As it was I was stuck in medical limbo and grounded for 45 days while waiting for the FAA to issue my new medical once the old one expired.

Learned 2 lessons from this experience 1) research your AME before going and 2) renew 2-3 months early to allow time to gather records and/or for the FAA bureaucracy to respond with a final disposition if there is an issue.

You do NOT want a denial if at all possible.

True but if the choice is between a denial from an AME which the FAA will consider a withdrawn application if you dont appeal within 30 days and a deferral that turns into an FAA denial, the better choice would appear to be an AME denial.
 
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One way to get the answer to your question of "what did the FAA have to say about my past applications?" Is to request a copy of your medical file from the FAA. Instructions to do that can be found here...


It takes 6-12 weeks to get the file. But what you do get is everything they have on you including all correspondence you sent to them and they sent to you. Also included is all of the 8500-8's complete with the info the AME added during the exam, all status letters and documentation you submitted at exam, and more.

All of this should not only ask the questions you posed above, but also assist in completing the new 8500-8 honestly and accurately.

So I filed the paperwork to receive my "complete airmen file" and paid $5.30 to receive 53 pages (technically most of them were doublesided but the backside on most were "this page intentionally left blank") of pretty much useless junk. Over a third of the packet was duplicates and none of it was the medical information I was looking for...

It was 2 copies of each of my "temporary certificates," all my 8710's (which I could have just as easily printed off from IACRA), the applicable written test results associated and pilot bill of rights associated with each 8710 and a change of address and a change of "public information"

Nothing related to my medical.
 
You applied for a medical certificate and you got a medical certificate. You didn't have to fill out a new app or have a new exam? So one app, one exam, one medical-very delayed. I'm no expert, but if it were me, I'd call that deferred. But you can discuss with the AME at your exam if you're worried about whether to check the box. He can make changes to the form if necessary.
 
If there was a denial, there would be a copy of the denial letter in the file. Perhaps it was erroneously omitted, as it doesn’t sound like the copies were carefully made. Agreed that perhaps just best to check with the AME at the next exam.
 
So I filed the paperwork to receive my "complete airmen file" and paid $5.30 to receive 53 pages (technically most of them were doublesided but the backside on most were "this page intentionally left blank") of pretty much useless junk. Over a third of the packet was duplicates and none of it was the medical information I was looking for...

It was 2 copies of each of my "temporary certificates," all my 8710's (which I could have just as easily printed off from IACRA), the applicable written test results associated and pilot bill of rights associated with each 8710 and a change of address and a change of "public information"

Nothing related to my medical.
That’s because you didn’t ask for you medical branch file. You are describing an Airman Branch file....
 
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