Hypoxia Training

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TommyG

Pattern Altitude
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I got to experience the FAA portable hypoxia chamber today. What an eye opener. They sat us down talked about the effects of hypoxia, how to use the oxygen mask, and a quick rundown of what we would be doing.

We went into the chamber, they said it was set at 28k feet. Almost immediately we all felt a little dizziness. About a minute in the guy outside the camber told one of the participants to do a basic math problem, she never go to the answer. He then asked me to count backwards from 100 in multiples of 3. He told me to write down the answer which was 94. Only after the chamber when we were debriefing, he asked me what the 94 i wrote down on the paper was. I honestly could not remember. Only after him reminding me about counting backwards, is when I remembered the task. He also had had us touch our nose and point to a guy named mike. I did remember the pointing to mike, I completely had no idea he told us to touch our nose, which I did do and had no recollection of. We had a checklist of symptoms we were supposed to check off every minute, and when we hot 3 symptoms we were supposed to put the oxygen mask on. none us put the mask on, even though we all checked off 3 or 4 symptoms.

It was a real good experience. I can honestly see how you can get in trouble real quick, and not be able to get yourself out if because you are just lost in a daze. If you see it come around, I highly suggest the experience.
 
They used to show us this video in the USAF when you’d go through chamber training. Pretty funny...and scary at the same time. Lol
 
It is very useful to know at what altitude your cognitive functions start to deteriorate. I do this sometimes by flying to a high altitude with a safety pilot and a pulse oxymeter.
 
This is very useful training for anybody who likes to fly high (pun surely intended).
I've been "planning" on doing this for a long time but so far haven't made any definite plans (partially due to the silly government-bureaucracy sign-up process) but I really want to take this training before I transition into the flight levels.
 
A pal of mine claimed to have been flying his certificated Lanceair at 18K feet when he experienced symptoms of hypoxia. He only really knew because we scientists all do in an academic sense. He was able to maintain his whits sufficiently to unkink the oxygen line.
 
I did the chamber in Reno last year. Very eye-opening indeed. I remember starting a math problem (something like 124+560) and about halfway through, I just sort of zoned out and didn't care anymore.

They had us sign our name and mine looks like a doctors prescription… Totally unidentifiable as my signature.
 
steingar said:
A pal of mine claimed to have been flying his certificated Lanceair at 18K feet when he experienced symptoms of hypoxia. He only really knew because we scientists all do in an academic sense. He was able to maintain his whits sufficiently to unkink the oxygen line.
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I would consider a pulse oxymeter a must-have when flying with oxygen.
 
I did the one in OKC. I lasted 5 minutes and without a care in the world.

This should be the method for putting death row inmates down.
sure fire way to do it, and nobody can say it is cruel.

Hypoxia would be a good way to go.
 
Have any of you experienced pilots discovered that you can't fly as high as when you started flying? Curious about how much age plays into it.
 
I wish the FAA people doing the dog and pony show with the portable simulated high-altitude chamber were actually doing the ground portion and had a CFI on freaking staff, so they could sign off on 61.31(g) for people.

It's a neat program, just seems dumb they don't take it that tiny step further and make it an actually useful sign-off...
 
I did the portable chamber experience when they brought it to Northwest Regional many years ago.

Really enjoyed it... and you could say it took my breath away.

My major symptoms was loss of color vision and loss of sense of time. I was off the respirator for nearly 6 minutes but only recall the monitor calling out minute 1 and minute 2.
 
denverpilot said:
I wish the FAA people doing the dog and pony show with the portable simulated high-altitude chamber were actually doing the ground portion and had a CFI on freaking staff, so they could sign off on 61.31(g) for people.

It's a neat program, just seems dumb they don't take it that tiny step further and make it an actually useful sign-off...
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They did when I went through. Gots the endorsement and everything.

But would gladly repeat the course and renew the endorsement if I ever got a flying job that frequently had me at "oxygen required" altitudes.
 
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AggieMike88 said:
I did the portable chamber experience when they brought it to Northwest Regional many years ago.
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I'd love to jump in one of those too but I hear that they discontinued the program. Which sucks because IMHO, this was one of the more worthwhile ideas the FAA had. *shrug*
I wish they reinstated it. Lots of good can come out of it. Does the FAA not understand ROI? Oh right, government organization .... nm ... mea cupla .... I'll go flog myself.

AggieMike88 said:
Really enjoyed it... and you could say it took my breath away.
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LOL
 
BigBadLou said:
ABSOLUTELY!
May I recommend one with an alarm? Because if you become hypoxic, you won't care to look at the display anyway. An alarm just might be the push you need to recognize a problem.
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The depressurization alarm is going off in the background of that somewhat "infamous" jet depressurization ATC recording until they finally somehow managed to be convinced by the controller to descend, slurring speech and all... hard to say if the alarm really did all that much for them, considering there was a quick-don mask for both of them, and they still succumbed to it... for a while.
 
FYI..

The portable chamber will be at Oshkosh this year and Sun and Fun next year.. At the FAA hangar at both events.
For Oshkosh they said that people line up before they even open the doors to the hangar so get there early..
 
LongRoadBob said:
Have any of you experienced pilots discovered that you can't fly as high as when you started flying? Curious about how much age plays into it.
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I did this a while back. I was in my late 20’s at the time. I’m a runner, and generally in good health. I was surprised when my hands started shaking uncontrollably early on. I was instructed to put my mask on. Many of the older guys hung on for quite a bit longer.
 
We have to do a similar thing, called the ROBD, semi-annually. Most of our folks who aren't relatively new, also did a real chamber ride in pensacola in the years before the thing was decommissioned. I think the chamber had more aggressive effects, but the ROBD (or portable system) is more accurate in terms of effects. Most hypoxia events, short of a rapid decompression at high altitude, are insidious. My personal symptoms are really not much until I am highly hypoxic.........basically feels like a good buzz, with some warming to my face, and at some point, the monkey skills start to require a lot more thought. Of the last 3 ROBD rides I've had, 2/3 of them have had an operator who questioned whether my mask was tight enough because my blood oxygen saturation was in their opinion, too low to have continued flying safely and complying with ATC instructions. While that might be curious to them, it has taught me that my own recognition will probably be pretty late. If they thought it was negative training, it was actually anything but. Realizing you have been trolling around multiple times, almost unaware for 5+ minutes with a 60-70% blood oxygen concentration is an eye opener. I've been hypoxic in the jet once, and it was pretty much along the same lines. By that point, I didn't even remember to select emergency oxygen (boldface step 1). That was a long time ago now, but all of those lessons are pretty well ingrained in me today.
 
iflyatiger said:
FYI..

The portable chamber will be at Oshkosh this year and Sun and Fun next year.. At the FAA hangar at both events.
For Oshkosh they said that people line up before they even open the doors to the hangar so get there early..
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Are they going to have the carbon monoxide chamber this year?
I haven't tried that one. Wondering how different my symptoms will be.
 
I live at 6500 feet. Maybe I should go on oxygen when I go to bed... :lol::lol:

Is it possible to pressurize my house..???

I did hypoxia training in the military long ago. Thanks to the fact that we were kept at maximum sleep deprivation, as soon as the mask came off I went to sleep.
 
Zeldman said:
I live at 6500 feet. Maybe I should go on oxygen when I go to bed... :lol::lol:

Is it possible to pressurize my house..???

I did hypoxia training in the military long ago. Thanks to the fact that we were kept at maximum sleep deprivation, as soon as the mask came off I went to sleep.
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LOL. I’m about 300’ below you in my bed.

I flew over the top of the KCOS Charlie at 10,500 coming home just so I could assure Direct the other day. Even though I was talking to them anyway.

“Radar contact, just let me know before you start any descents for my departures...”

“Willco...” :) I always like when I can sneak a Wilco in legitimately. LOL.
 
BigBadLou said:
I'd love to jump in one of those too but I hear that they discontinued the program. Which sucks because IMHO, this was one of the more worthwhile ideas the FAA had. *shrug*
I wish they reinstated it. Lots of good can come out of it. Does the FAA not understand ROI? Oh right, government organization .... nm ... mea cupla .... I'll go flog myself.


LOL
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I did this just this past weekend.
 
LongRoadBob said:
Have any of you experienced pilots discovered that you can't fly as high as when you started flying? Curious about how much age plays into it.
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Did the Houston one recently. Most of the young guys needed the mask before the 5-6 minute limit was achieved
 
BigBadLou said:
That is great news. Got a link where we could sign up, please?
We have several local pilots who would love to undergo this training.
Thank you in advance.
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It came in an email from the FAA. Are you signed up to receive emails when they have local training or seminars?
 
TommyG said:
It came in an email from the FAA. Are you signed up to receive emails when they have local training or seminars?
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Yes I am and no, I have not received any email about local training ... because, frankly, the FAA doesn't really care about Nuevo Kalyfornya in the middle of the desert here.
I have heard that some people got lucky that they brought the baro chamber trailer to their locality but I also heard that it was discontinued. Of course that is only hearsay and I have no way to verify that.
Any chance someone has a link that lists the schedule of the mobile baro chamber training? I can't find anything in Google.
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Are they going to have the carbon monoxide chamber this year?
I haven't tried that one. Wondering how different my symptoms will be.
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Will they be doing breathalyzer testing as you drink shots of methyl alcohol in the booth next to it?
 
Salty said:
Will they be doing breathalyzer testing as you drink shots of methyl alcohol in the booth next to it?
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I was thinking at OSH they should randomly grab pilots from camping in the evening after multiple beers and toss them in a simulator just to see how they do. Ha.
 
denverpilot said:
I was thinking at OSH they should randomly grab pilots from camping in the evening after multiple beers and toss them in a simulator just to see how they do. Ha.
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I can tell you from personal experience that after 2 beers, I can keep the needles centered on an ILS down to mins as much as with 0 beers. (sim, of course, sim only)
And NO, we're NOT talking the light beer lemonade c*ap. :)
 
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