Garmin intros new InReach... the "mini"

A friend took one of those on a rafting trip down the Grand Canyon... the resulting track and some pinging him back and forth with jokes like "why'd you stop?" at night... all seemed to work well.

(Edit: Not the mini, but the previous model. Sure the mini probably works just fine.)
 
There is also some more advanced dataplans and services for InReach available with a dedicated real email-address, SmartSafety, automatic deadman switch and more. see www.protegear.com/english
 
my son has the earlier model and it's a hoot to follow along on the adventures....woks great.
 
Ok so it not only woks great but works great....
 
I have a few questions:

1.) If this was in the airplane (high wing) would it be able to transmit to the iridium satellite?
2.) Is it legal to have this device transmitting from the airplane while in flight?
3.) Their cheapest plan charges for tracking points ($0.10/each). Is that something that a person manually initiates so the cost can be managed?

The cheapest plan is probably around $150/yr. If it can reach the satellite while en-route it could be a awesome alternative to a VFR flight plan and compliment FF for redundancy.

I could also see my brother using it for his big portage into Canada fishing trips where he doesn't get cell service.
 
Check out the Backcountry Pilot forums, a lot of people using it for tracking there. I'm about to order one for my Alaska trip.
 
Sinistar said:
I have a few questions:

1.) If this was in the airplane (high wing) would it be able to transmit to the iridium satellite?
2.) Is it legal to have this device transmitting from the airplane while in flight?
3.) Their cheapest plan charges for tracking points ($0.10/each). Is that something that a person manually initiates so the cost can be managed?

The cheapest plan is probably around $150/yr. If it can reach the satellite while en-route it could be a awesome alternative to a VFR flight plan and compliment FF for redundancy.

I could also see my brother using it for his big portage into Canada fishing trips where he doesn't get cell service.
Click to expand...

1. Sometimes/Usually. If it doesn’t see a satellite it’ll keep trying and get through eventually.

2. Up to the PIC to decide if it’s causing harmful interference, like all on board electronic devices.

3. Yes. Turn it off when tracking is not desired. ;) (Seriously though I think it’s part of the software on your smartphone that it talks to whether it’s in tracking mode or just dumb mode waiting for you to ask it to send a location/text. There used to also be some canned messages you could pre-program to send to someone that didn’t count against your texting limit but don’t know if that survived the Delorme to Garmin buy-out.

Spot kept going up in price and Garmin hadn’t started a big push with their own devices until recently. They had re-badged Delorme devices. Looks like they’re going to try to kill Spot. If you can handle the coverage holes of Spot, they might start making deals... haven’t checked.
 
Sinistar said:
I have a few questions:

1.) If this was in the airplane (high wing) would it be able to transmit to the iridium satellite?
Click to expand...

In a high wing if you have a fancy back window you can put it there otherwise I typically tuck it on the right side of the windscreen. I don't have access to the data any more but as I recall we typically got about 95% of tracking within a minute and almost never exceeded 5 minute delay.(Time from the location being recorded until the point hit our database.)

DSC_0623.jpg
 
Okay, so this will probably work in the plane - just find the right spot and pilots discretion on interference with other airplane stuff! So its more about the money. I skimmed the manual and looked at the plans. So the following seems relevant w/r to cost:

  • These units cost around $400 to purchase
  • There is a $20 one time only activation fee.
  • Under the "Safety" plan, each tracking point sent up to the satellite network is 10cents.
  • All other plans have unlimited tracking points.
  • The Freedom plans are more per month but let you run it a month and stop.
  • The Freedom plans cost a minimum fee of $25/yr
  • They all have a SOS feature and all provide limited or unlimited text messages.
...so using that as a guideline, here would be two typical use cases:

"Safety" Plan: Limit To Flying Use Only ($290/yr)
  • Fly 100hrs per year.
  • Flying every month so the annual plan saves $120/yr over the flexible monthly plan.
  • Set the tracker to send every 10 minutes if there is movement.
  • Assume and average of 10 tracking points per hour with taxi, etc.
  • 1000 tracking points per year costs $100.
  • That is $244/yr before monthly fees so round up to $290/yr
  • The price goes down if you fly less or elect to not use it on pattern work, etc.

"Recreation" Plan: No Limit On Flying Or Other Use ($405/yr)
  • Unlimited tracking points for $25/month
  • Another 30 text messages included per month
  • That is $360/yr and probably $405/yr with monthly fees.
  • It can be used for other things.

For us, the first option seems a bit high but I could see electing to use this 100% of the time in place of a VFR flight plan. And with the ability to text it seems like a better option than a PLB, but costing considerably more over several years.

Time to drop Netflix :eek:
 
chartbundle said:
In a high wing if you have a fancy back window you can put it there otherwise I typically tuck it on the right side of the windscreen.
Click to expand...

Yup. I hang mine on the microphone hook on the left side of the wind screen. No issues after 20K or so miles.

tracks.jpg
 
I've given this serious thought the past few weeks, as I'm flying VFR cross country in June. I thought it would bee cool for the family to track my progress. However, cost wise, at least for me, it doesn't make sense. All flying after that will be local of shorter cross country flights, where my iPhone will be sufficient. The tracking plan, even the least expensive would be a waste. I'd rather buy a PLB.

So, If you don't need the LIVE tracking feature or TEXT messaging, you are better served, IMHO, with a PLB. Way less costly (Just Purchase Price) and not dependent on a private company to process the notifications, should you be in distress.
 
C-1 PILOT said:
The tracking plan, even the least expensive would be a waste. I'd rather buy a PLB.

So, If you don't need the LIVE tracking feature or TEXT messaging, you are better served, IMHO, with a PLB. Way less costly (Just Purchase Price) and not dependent on a private company to process the notifications, should you be in distress.
Click to expand...

I have both. Here's my rationalization.

For the InReach, I love being able to be in touch in non-emergencies. I've used it camping in Idaho to make lodging arrangements. I've used it many times in flight to arrange ground transportation and alert people as to delays. I have it setup to send emails to friends when I take off and land so that they can rally the troops if I go missing. They can message me first and I can reply in the event that I don't need assistance. I do also like the tracking feature, which you've seen above in the map of my breadcrumbs.

For the PLB, it's a backstop if the InReach gets incapacitated. It's wired into SAR. It uses a different messaging layer than the InReach. So if one is not working, the other is likely to be.

For me, I can justify all this because I'm regularly over some pretty remote and rugged terrain. For you, it sounds like the PLB might indeed be the better choice. If I was flying less than 100 hours a year and/or only in the US, I might consider the same.
 
C-1 PILOT said:
I've given this serious thought the past few weeks, as I'm flying VFR cross country in June. I thought it would bee cool for the family to track my progress. However, cost wise, at least for me, it doesn't make sense. All flying after that will be local of shorter cross country flights, where my iPhone will be sufficient. The tracking plan, even the least expensive would be a waste. I'd rather buy a PLB.

So, If you don't need the LIVE tracking feature or TEXT messaging, you are better served, IMHO, with a PLB. Way less costly (Just Purchase Price) and not dependent on a private company to process the notifications, should you be in distress.
Click to expand...

In a way, doesn't this come down to how injured the pilot and passengers are after an emergency landing or worse.

If you are awake and alert you can use the PLB and maybe even get cell service. You're more likely to have a PLB. And more likely that it works since its a one time purchase. No monthly unpaid bill preventing you from using it (although I bet the SOS feature works on the inReach even if the bill isn't paid).

But what If you are incapacitated? This will have a track of your flight to within 10 minutes (say 22 mile radius in our case). But I suspect it will update again once stationary so lets say within 100's of feet. Since you are incapacitated you won't be pressing the SOS button (on either device). So it then comes down to someone reporting you overdue. Let's say it takes 8hrs for friends or family to report you overdue. At least they could give the emergency services a location 22 miles and probably within 100ft. With a PLB only you might not be found for days.

I'm not saying one is better than the other. Obviously one is better than none. Interesting either way! And the ability to text in flight at any level is something I didn't think of. When I fly to my parents the toughest part to arrange is when they should pick us up. If we can get flight following they can track on flight aware. But that may not be possible. I have tried texting from the air but it sometimes doesn't go through until we landed. Is it worth $300 a year for this...probably not. I guess two planes could communicate this way as well.
 
Sinistar said:
But what If you are incapacitated? This will have a track of your flight to within 10 minutes (say 22 mile radius in our case). But I suspect it will update again once stationary so lets say within 100's of feet.
Click to expand...

If the device survives the crash, then it will send another ping in 10 minutes or less. There isn't anything magic that happens if it becomes stationary, but it is indeed a benefit that it will keep trying so long as it hasn't been smashed. PLBs need to survive the crash to work also, which is something lots of people forget. I keep the PLB within arms reach in a padded container. The InReach is hanging near the windshield.

Sinistar said:
And the ability to text in flight at any level is something I didn't think of. When I fly to my parents the toughest part to arrange is when they should pick us up. Is it worth $300 a year for this...probably not.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I wouldn't have bought it just for that, but I've been surprised at how often it comes in handy!

My favorite example was last spring in Idaho (video below) when we decided that it was time for a legit shower (the spring streams were ice cold from snow melt) and arranged a night at the Flying "B" Ranch via InReach. Great shower. Good food. Horses woke us up the next morning grazing next to our tents.

 
rwellner98 said:
Yup. I hang mine on the microphone hook on the left side of the wind screen. No issues after 20K or so miles.

tracks.jpg
Click to expand...

From the look of that map, what are you bringing back and forth from south america. Just pulling your leg;)
 
Glad somebody is keeping the whale oil supply flowing, I was becoming worried of the scarcity as of late.
 
rwellner98 said:
Whale oil for the antique lamp trade.
Click to expand...

Seems like the sat-tech makes it waaay too easy to track which airstrip-cut-into-the-sugar-cane you are using. ;)
 
Sinistar said:
In a way, doesn't this come down to how injured the pilot and passengers are after an emergency landing or worse.

If you are awake and alert you can use the PLB and maybe even get cell service. You're more likely to have a PLB. And more likely that it works since its a one time purchase. No monthly unpaid bill preventing you from using it (although I bet the SOS feature works on the inReach even if the bill isn't paid).

But what If you are incapacitated? This will have a track of your flight to within 10 minutes (say 22 mile radius in our case). But I suspect it will update again once stationary so lets say within 100's of feet. Since you are incapacitated you won't be pressing the SOS button (on either device). So it then comes down to someone reporting you overdue. Let's say it takes 8hrs for friends or family to report you overdue. At least they could give the emergency services a location 22 miles and probably within 100ft. With a PLB only you might not be found for days.

I'm not saying one is better than the other. Obviously one is better than none. Interesting either way! And the ability to text in flight at any level is something I didn't think of. When I fly to my parents the toughest part to arrange is when they should pick us up. If we can get flight following they can track on flight aware. But that may not be possible. I have tried texting from the air but it sometimes doesn't go through until we landed. Is it worth $300 a year for this...probably not. I guess two planes could communicate this way as well.
Click to expand...

Hopefully, if incapacitated, your aircrafts 406 ELT would have activated when you crashed, given there was enough force to trigger it. There are many scenarios, one being, you escape, but the ELT in the plane was damaged or destroyed. Now what to do? Deploy your PLB! If you know you are headed for an off field landing, I would hope I have the wits about me to deploy both the in aircraft ELT and my personal PLB before I ditch or attempt an off field landing. I could care less at that point about texting.
 
C-1 PILOT said:
There are many scenarios, one being, you escape, but the ELT in the plane was damaged or destroyed. Now what to do? Deploy your PLB! If you know you are headed for an off field landing, I would hope I have the wits about me to deploy both the in aircraft ELT and my personal PLB before I ditch or attempt an off field landing. I couldn't care less at that point about texting.
Click to expand...

PLBs are great. But remember that you could also hit the SOS button on your InReach before attempting that landing and, if things worked out fine, then the texting would be a valuable service to tell SAR that you don't need very expensive resources to be deployed to rescue you.

Whether it's worth the cost or not is a value judgement that will differ between people, but as I've previously written, I've been really happy to have that feature at my disposal. If I was forced to carry only one device, there is no question that it would be an InReach rather than an ELT or PLB. Fortunately, I don't have to make that choice.
 
rwellner98 said:
PLBs are great. But remember that you could also hit the SOS button on your InReach before attempting that landing and, if things worked out fine, then the texting would be a valuable service to tell SAR that you don't need very expensive resources to be deployed to rescue you.

Whether it's worth the cost or not is a value judgement that will differ between people, but as I've previously written, I've been really happy to have that feature at my disposal. If I was forced to carry only one device, there is no question that it would be an InReach rather than an ELT or PLB. Fortunately, I don't have to make that choice.
Click to expand...

:yeahthat:

The ELT seems an expensive device considering how often it fails to operate effectively when needed. Have not seen any data that shows the 406 is any better in that respect than the old 121.5s.

Friend of mine with a SPOT activated it as part of his forced approach after an engine failure in his 206. Got the airplane down into a field and walked away just fine. <15 minutes later a police helicopter was approaching. I don't go anywhere without mine on the glareshield now.
 
rwellner98 said:
PLBs are great. But remember that you could also hit the SOS button on your InReach before attempting that landing and, if things worked out fine, then the texting would be a valuable service to tell SAR that you don't need very expensive resources to be deployed to rescue you.

Whether it's worth the cost or not is a value judgement that will differ between people, but as I've previously written, I've been really happy to have that feature at my disposal. If I was forced to carry only one device, there is no question that it would be an InReach rather than an ELT or PLB. Fortunately, I don't have to make that choice.
Click to expand...

We would like to think SAR works like that, but when you call, they will send assets per THEIR protocols, not what we tell them or think we need. It’s just the way the system works. I base that on experience and my employment choice the past 40 yrs.

If I flew the outback like you, I’d definitely utilize a tracker style unit like Spot or In-Reach.
 
C-1 PILOT said:
We would like to think SAR works like that, but when you call, they will send assets per THEIR protocols, not what we tell them or think we need. It’s just the way the system works. I base that on experience and my employment choice the past 40 yrs.
Click to expand...

That's really surprising. So walk me through it.

o My engine fails
o I activate my PLB, because I'm in nasty mountains and am very likely to be incapacitate when I hit the trees or rocks
o I manage to glide to a nearby airstrip, which happens to be Johnson Creek where there is a phone, but is also a really long way from where SAR resources are located
o I call someone (NOAA?) and report that everything is fine

In that case the chopper is still gonna be deployed? Ambulance? Fire? Police? Park guards? My call to NOAA changes nothing in the response?
 
GRG55 said:
...The ELT seems an expensive device considering how often it fails to operate effectively when needed. Have not seen any data that shows the 406 is any better in that respect than the old 121.5s....
Click to expand...
I found a comparison of 121.5 and 406 beacons. I don't see any data on failure-to-activate rates, but the false alarm rate for 121.5 beacons is MUCH higher. Also, I think that a 406 beacon is required to have a switch installed on the aircraft panel, which can be used to manually activate it on the way down.

http://www.sarsat.noaa.gov/406vs121.pdf
 
Palmpilot said:
I found a comparison of 121.5 and 406 beacons. I don't see any data on failure-to-activate rates, but the false alarm rate for 121.5 beacons is MUCH higher. Also, I think that a 406 beacon is required to have a switch installed on the aircraft panel, which can be used to manually activate it on the way down.

http://www.sarsat.noaa.gov/406vs121.pdf
Click to expand...

The devil is in the details on that report. The non-distress signals included carrier only from RF interference sources that weren’t ELTs at all. And they haven’t been listening for those for many many years now.

It’s a pretty useless report.
 
When you posted this I thought it was gonna be some cool new iPad mini look a like from Garmin.
 
I use mine almost every flight and have the auto-subscription ($26/month) tracking and texts aren’t unlimited but I’ve never exceeded limits. It’s great peace of mind for flying, backcountry skiing, hunting etc. out here in the Montana backcountry. Used it on fishing boats in Alaska for months at a time without phone service to text with the old lady. Also the $17/year(?) rescue insurance is a great deal. Beats paying 50k for a rescue if need be. (Their is fine print to be read for rescue insurance)

It also has a free app for iOS or Android and can be used in airplane mode to save battery. I always carry an external battery pack too, would love to get some Goal Zero portable solar chargers too.
 
rwellner98 said:
That's really surprising. So walk me through it.

o My engine fails
o I activate my PLB, because I'm in nasty mountains and am very likely to be incapacitate when I hit the trees or rocks
o I manage to glide to a nearby airstrip, which happens to be Johnson Creek where there is a phone, but is also a really long way from where SAR resources are located
o I call someone (NOAA?) and report that everything is fine

In that case the chopper is still gonna be deployed? Ambulance? Fire? Police? Park guards? My call to NOAA changes nothing in the response?
Click to expand...

Unfortunately that scenario is extremely unlikely. If you're flying back there and you have to make a forced landing you're going to need help. I have had pretty good luck with Verizon in the Idaho backcountry so have just gone with the plb option...
 
rwellner98 said:
That's really surprising. So walk me through it.

o My engine fails
o I activate my PLB, because I'm in nasty mountains and am very likely to be incapacitate when I hit the trees or rocks
o I manage to glide to a nearby airstrip, which happens to be Johnson Creek where there is a phone, but is also a really long way from where SAR resources are located
o I call someone (NOAA?) and report that everything is fine

In that case the chopper is still gonna be deployed? Ambulance? Fire? Police? Park guards? My call to NOAA changes nothing in the response?
Click to expand...

Immediate cancellation should not be a problem, as in a false alarm. Most agencies will act with an abundance of caution and dispatch a first responder. Request the fire department and tell them it’s a trash can fire and they need only send an engine. Well, you will get an engine, ladder truck and possibly in some places an ambulance.

They rather be over prepared than under. It’s to our benefit, the end user.
 
idahoflier said:
Unfortunately that scenario is extremely unlikely. If you're flying back there and you have to make a forced landing you're going to need help. I have had pretty good luck with Verizon in the Idaho backcountry so have just gone with the plb option...
Click to expand...

I haven't once had coverage in the places I fly into there (Frank Church, Nez Perce, Bitterroot, etc...). But, yeah, of course it's a long shot example. It was meant to clarify things, not to guess that the odds of surviving unscathed in the mountains there were particularly high.

C-1 PILOT said:
Immediate cancellation should not be a problem, as in a false alarm. Most agencies will act with an abundance of caution and dispatch a first responder. Request the fire department and tell them it’s a trash can fire and they need only send an engine. Well, you will get an engine, ladder truck and possibly in some places an ambulance.
Click to expand...

Ok, I think we were just talking past each other. I wasn't suggesting that I dictate what equipment they should send. Just that the InReach would be useful in instances where no support turned out to be necessary, to avoid the deployment of resources that weren't needed.
 
rwellner98 said:
I haven't once had coverage in the places I fly into there (Frank Church, Nez Perce, Bitterroot, etc...).
Click to expand...

Of course YMMV...

rwellner98 said:
But, yeah, of course it's a long shot example. It was meant to clarify things, not to guess that the odds of surviving unscathed in the mountains there were particularly high.
Click to expand...

Understood, I wasn't trying to debate the suvivablity odds either, just offering a different opinion and the reason behind it...
 
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