My Airplane Purchase Quest

Mooney Fan

Mooney Fan

Line Up and Wait
Joined
Sep 17, 2017
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998
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Indian Mound, TN
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Mooney Fan
So far, I'm 0-2. The most recent fail was on a 69 Yankee that didn't make it through the pre-buy. I had $750 into it when I told them to button it up, we're done here. The Yankee had a lot of 'slop' in control surfaces hinge bearings/bushings. Additional slop in yoke behind the panel and a loose nose gear. After speaking with John up at Excell Air Services about what the mechanic found, I was really confident I made the right decision in canceling the deal down in Georgia.

Now I have another Yankee that has me intrigued. Seller is part of the Grumman Gang and has put $$$ into the plane. It has the 125 hp mod with 105 since mod. Airframe has 2400 or so hours.

Learning not to get my hopes up and to stay firm, and not compromise on what I want. It might take me a while and a minor investment in Pre-buys, but eventually, the right one will come.

BTW, can anyone recommend a good shop in the New Orleans area to conduct a pre-purchase eval on this new find?.

Thanks
 
Can't help with the pre-purchase, but best of luck! It's tough finding the right plane. My score is 1-3. The second two I went after, the first of which said he wouldn't let a mechanic touch his airplane... then he tried to sell me airplanes that weren't his. I very seriously considered calling the police on him, bat**** crazy. The next guy just didn't want to sell even though it was listed as for sale. I called a few times and he said I could definitely go down with a mechanic. Got one all lined up, just went to confirm with the seller if dates were good... never returned my calls or e-mails. The last one was a winner! Still needs some Mx done, but I got it at a price where I still got out ahead.

It's hard, I was emotionally attached to every single one I was going after. Still am to the first. But I love my plane and it was totally worth it!
 
The $750 is much much cheaper than what you prob would have spent if u bought the wrong plane. Sux but you’ll find the right one in time.
 
Mtns2Skies said:
Can't help with the pre-purchase, but best of luck! It's tough finding the right plane. My score is 1-3. The second two I went after, the first of which said he wouldn't let a mechanic touch his airplane... then he tried to sell me airplanes that weren't his. I very seriously considered calling the police on him, bat**** crazy. The next guy just didn't want to sell even though it was listed as for sale. I called a few times and he said I could definitely go down with a mechanic. Got one all lined up, just went to confirm with the seller if dates were good... never returned my calls or e-mails. The last one was a winner! Still needs some Mx done, but I got it at a price where I still got out ahead.

It's hard, I was emotionally attached to every single one I was going after. Still am to the first. But I love my plane and it was totally worth it!
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Thanks for the response. That sounds like a nightmare for sure. Glad you found the right one for you

-Geaux
 
A good pre purchase is always warranted. Better to loose on the way in rather getting stuck with a maintenance hog. Good luck with the next one.
 
Clark1961 said:
Everything comes from together. It is one of the thermo laws...or directives....or something
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2nd Law of Thermodynamics I think..."Everything gets worse with time" :confused:
Or maybe it's the 4rth Law..."Things get worse faster, much faster, under pressure" o_O
 
Having time on your side is your best bet...it has always seemed to me that usually the people that get planes that give them headaches are the ones that rush into a purchase. When I've bought planes, I first decide what I want, then decide how rare they are...that at least gives me a rough idea how long it should take, then I double my estimate.
 
Get your Mooney right now. Screw Grummans, they're slow, weird and ugly. The damn Yankee was designed by Jim Bede, for Odin's sake! You can pick up a very workable M20C for not that much more. Yeah, it'll cost more in maintenance, but it'll go fast and do what you want. You'll spend a lot less if you get your Mooney now than own another aircraft in the meantime. Think about the cash you spent chasing these turkeys. You're going to have to spend more to unload the damn thing, and then even more to get your Mooney.
 
steingar said:
Get your Mooney right now. Screw Grummans, they're slow, weird and ugly. The damn Yankee was designed by Jim Bede, for Odin's sake! You can pick up a very workable M20C for not that much more. Yeah, it'll cost more in maintenance, but it'll go fast and do what you want. You'll spend a lot less if you get your Mooney now than own another aircraft in the meantime. Think about the cash you spent chasing these turkeys. You're going to have to spend more to unload the damn thing, and then even more to get your Mooney.
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I agree
 
steingar said:
Get your Mooney right now. Screw Grummans, they're slow, weird and ugly. The damn Yankee was designed by Jim Bede, for Odin's sake! You can pick up a very workable M20C for not that much more. Yeah, it'll cost more in maintenance, but it'll go fast and do what you want. You'll spend a lot less if you get your Mooney now than own another aircraft in the meantime. Think about the cash you spent chasing these turkeys. You're going to have to spend more to unload the damn thing, and then even more to get your Mooney.
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Noted...

But wait, the Yankee is slower than what? Not a 150 or 152 and definitely faster than a Skyhawk all on 6 gph. If I pass on the Mooney now, at least Ill have something that reportedly, flies like one. :confused:
 
Mooney Fan said:
Noted...

But wait, the Yankee is slower than what? Not a 150 or 152 and definitely faster than a Skyhawk all on 6 gph. If I pass on the Mooney now, at least Ill have something that reportedly, flies like one. :confused:
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Being faster than a Skyhawk is nothing to brag about. It just makes more sense to get your last plane first. And whoever said Yankees fly like Mooneys is a fan boy at best.
 
steingar said:
Being faster than a Skyhawk is nothing to brag about. It just makes more sense to get your last plane first. And whoever said Yankees fly like Mooneys is a fan boy at best.
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When you're in the market for a 2-seater it is. :)

As of right now, my mission does not justify the expense of the Mooney.
 
From what I understand about these little Grummans the owners or either fanatical about them or very "manyanna..." with the upkeep.. Good luck in you search....

This one has been listed for a while and could probably blow the doors off of any M20, if it didn't have to stop for fuel every ten minutes:p

https://www.aso.com/listings/spec/V...l=True&pagingNo=1&searchId=35673452&dealerid=

If you need some west coast logistics help shoot me a PM will be glad to assist
 
Ventucky Red said:
From what I understand about these little Grummans the owners or either fanatical about them or very "manyanna..." with the upkeep.. Good luck in you search....

This one has been listed for a while and could probably blow the doors off of any M20, if it didn't have to stop for fuel every ten minutes:p

https://www.aso.com/listings/spec/V...l=True&pagingNo=1&searchId=35673452&dealerid=

If you need some west coast logistics help shoot me a PM will be glad to assist
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Appreciate that. When I do find one, I plan to fly out to my old stomping grounds out West at SZP, CMA, OXR area. Learned to fly at SZP
 
Mooney Fan said:
Appreciate that. When I do find one, I plan to fly out to my old stomping grounds out West at SZP, CMA, OXR area. Learned to fly at SZP
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That is where I am based... did you learn at CP Aviation?
 
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Ventucky Red said:
That is where I am based... did you learn at CP Aviation?
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Small world. I lived in Oxnard for 39 years up until summer of 2016. Retired from Pt. Mugu. I learned at Santa Paula Flight Center back in 1996. Got my PPL there and my taildragger cert in their Citabria. And, they had a fine Mooney M20C I put time in. The flight center closed down I believe in the late 90's. Got my instrument rating from CIA over in Camarrillo.
 
Mooney Fan said:
I have about 60 plus hours in a M20C and loved it. The Yankee is my first attempt at ownership. Will likely choose a Mooney when I upgrade. Right now, its cost prohibitive
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This is how I ended with 2 airplanes: bought a starter airplane and later upgraded to M20E. And now nobody is buying. I suppose it should be easier to sell your AA-1, but still...
 
zaitcev said:
This is how I ended with 2 airplanes: bought a starter airplane and later upgraded to M20E. And now nobody is buying. I suppose it should be easier to sell your AA-1, but still...
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Whether they're buying depends on what you're selling. Got a nice Skyhawk or Skylane priced reasonably? Gone. An older twin or a O-290 powered Tri-Pacer? You might have that for a while.
 
Hammonds at Houma impressed me when I dropped a TR182 off for a prebuy and I was the seller. Seemed like a good facility.
 
Think I posted somewhere else about this but a friend of mine is an A&P at KASD. He has owned and maintained a little Yankee for many years - he would likely be a good guy to do a prebuy on one. I can ask if he's available and what he'd charge if you'd like.
 
What’s your budget? For a VFR only, affordable and reasonably fast two seater I purchased a 1999 Diamond DA20-C1 last year for 40k $. I then put 15k$ on it in order to bring it to my standards and I’ve been very happy with it. It cruises at 120 kts for three and a half hours plus reserve. It also has a very slow stall speed, which I like a lot.

Sure, it has some drawbacks, but for my needs it was a good fit.

Good luck with your search
 
Update- Appears the owner has cold feet so I have moved on. I tell you. So far, I went and looked at a 64 C-150D that is A&P/IA owned that was in poor shape. Second was a 69 AA-1 that was not as advertised and failed my pre-buy criteria. 3rd at bat has a really nice 69 Yankee that he was not actively selling, but said he would sale to me if I wanted it. We agreed to proceed and I made contact with Fly By Night aviation at Hammond to conduct the pre-buy. Passed on to seller and I have not heard back from him in 4 days.

Next is a Florida based (sigh) AA1-C with a low time (513 hrs) SFREM engine 16 years ago. Plane has excellent complete logs. I plan to fly down and take a look at it next week. Have a shop on stand-by to do a Pre-buy should I go that far. Key areas of concern for me are the location (think corrosion) and the low hours since rebuild.

Below is a picture of engine. Does that firewall look like it has the gray dust sign of corrosion? Logs show during last annual in 2017 the engine was 'cleaned from oxidation and painted'. Warning flag?

Thanks

FW2.jpg


Firewall.jpg
 
Mooney Fan said:
Update- Appears the owner has cold feet so I have moved on. I tell you. So far, I went and looked at a 64 C-150D that is A&P/IA owned that was in poor shape. Second was a 69 AA-1 that was not as advertised and failed my pre-buy criteria. 3rd at bat has a really nice 69 Yankee that he was not actively selling, but said he would sale to me if I wanted it. We agreed to proceed and I made contact with Fly By Night aviation at Hammond to conduct the pre-buy. Passed on to seller and I have not heard back from him in 4 days.

Next is a Florida based (sigh) AA1-C with a low time (513 hrs) SFREM engine 16 years ago. Plane has excellent complete logs. I plan to fly down and take a look at it next week. Have a shop on stand-by to do a Pre-buy should I go that far. Key areas of concern for me are the location (think corrosion) and the low hours since rebuild.

Below is a picture of engine. Does that firewall look like it has the gray dust sign of corrosion? Logs show during last annual in 2017 the engine was 'cleaned from oxidation and painted'. Warning flag?

Thanks

FW2.jpg


Firewall.jpg
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It’s looks like light corrosion but that’s not an area I’d be concerned with. Grummans use a brass landing gear bracket that attaches to an aluminum, tubular spar. That’s a common area for corrosion and an expensive fix that may require a new spar. Flechair has pics of it when it gets real bad.

Lots of nice AA1s on Barnstormers. Good luck in your search.
 
Velocity173 said:
It’s looks like light corrosion but that’s not an area I’d be concerned with. Grummans use a brass landing gear bracket that attaches to an aluminum, tubular spar. That’s a common area for corrosion and an expensive fix that may require a new spar. Flechair has pics of it when it gets real bad.

Lots of nice AA1s on Barnstormers. Good luck in your search.
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Thanks. The previous AA1 I had in pre-buy that was an area I specifically asked to be inspected. Same for this one.
 
Mooney Fan said:
Thanks. The previous AA1 I had in pre-buy that was an area I specifically asked to be inspected. Same for this one.
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Yeah, when I bought my AA5, that’s the first area I looked. Had a tiny bit of white powder there but nothing some scotch brite wouldn’t remove. Mine spent most of its life in Canada so it was pretty much corrosion free. Seen some Florida Grummans close to the beach that were just rotting away on the ramp. I’d shy away from looking at anything in FL.
 
Mooney Fan said:
Update- Appears the owner has cold feet so I have moved on. I tell you. So far, I went and looked at a 64 C-150D that is A&P/IA owned that was in poor shape. Second was a 69 AA-1 that was not as advertised and failed my pre-buy criteria. 3rd at bat has a really nice 69 Yankee that he was not actively selling, but said he would sale to me if I wanted it. We agreed to proceed and I made contact with Fly By Night aviation at Hammond to conduct the pre-buy. Passed on to seller and I have not heard back from him in 4 days.
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Airplane buying sucks. It really makes you understand why people use brokers. The one I found was the last one I was going to look at before booking a ticket to Alaska and not leaving until I found the plane I wanted (many of my type up there).

There's just as many sketchy people trying to buy planes as well. Makes for an all around unpleasant experience for the honest person. Goodluck!
 
Fingers crossed for a “good one”this time. The plane buying process can be rough, but when you find the right one, it makes the journey worthwhile. Definitely sketchy sellers and buyers out there, but there are honest ones as well.
 
Mooney Fan said:
Update- Appears the owner has cold feet so I have moved on. I tell you. So far, I went and looked at a 64 C-150D that is A&P/IA owned that was in poor shape. Second was a 69 AA-1 that was not as advertised and failed my pre-buy criteria. 3rd at bat has a really nice 69 Yankee that he was not actively selling, but said he would sale to me if I wanted it. We agreed to proceed and I made contact with Fly By Night aviation at Hammond to conduct the pre-buy. Passed on to seller and I have not heard back from him in 4 days.

Next is a Florida based (sigh) AA1-C with a low time (513 hrs) SFREM engine 16 years ago. Plane has excellent complete logs. I plan to fly down and take a look at it next week. Have a shop on stand-by to do a Pre-buy should I go that far. Key areas of concern for me are the location (think corrosion) and the low hours since rebuild.

Below is a picture of engine. Does that firewall look like it has the gray dust sign of corrosion? Logs show during last annual in 2017 the engine was 'cleaned from oxidation and painted'. Warning flag?

Thanks

FW2.jpg


Firewall.jpg
Click to expand...
How long has it been in FL???

500 hrs in 16 years AND based in FL is what concerns me. It’s sounds like it has been sitting in that environment for a long time which is never good unless it was inside a tight climate controlled hangar the whole time.
 
Fearless Tower said:
How long has it been in FL???

500 hrs in 16 years AND based in FL is what concerns me. It’s sounds like it has been sitting in that environment for a long time which is never good unless it was inside a tight climate controlled hangar the whole time.
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The plane was in Washington 06/07, Michigan 07/10 and has been in Fl for last 8 years
 
Mooney Fan said:
The plane was in Washington 06/07, Michigan 07/10 and has been in Fl for last 8 years
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Has the seller been doing any oil analysis? Is it hangared? How much has it flown in the 8 years it has been in FL?

100 hrs a year and in a nice hangar, it might be ok. 50 hrs/year and parked outside or a dilapidated hangar, probably not worth your time.
 
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Fearless Tower said:
Has the seller been doing any oil analysis? Is it hangared? How much has it flown in the 8 years it has been in FL?

100 hrs a year and in a nice hangar, it might be ok. 50 hrs/year and parked outside or a dilapidated hangar, probably not worth your time.
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Don't know about analysis but need to inquire. The plane has flown only 110 hours in 7 years and it is hangared. Flying a little over 1 hour a month.

What do you mean by 'gangster' lol
 
Fearless Tower said:
Gangster was apparently the autocorrect version of ‘hangared’.
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Lol! I was wondering what gangster meant. I was like, maybe he’s saying it’s a former drug runner from Columbia to Florida or something. :D
 
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