Make & Model and Open Pilot Warranty

[Buck Rizvi]

My insurance has an Open Pilot Warranty that will cover certain pilots that have at least 25 hours in the same "make & model" as my aircraft.

My plane is a Cherokee Six 300.

Would an otherwise qualified pilot with 25 hours in a Cherokee Six 260 be covered by my insurance under the Open Pilot provision?

Are all Cherokee Six's essentially the same, from a make and model standpoint, when it comes to insurance?

You could technically say the same thing about a C172 N vs. S model, so I'm hoping the answer is "it doesn't matter, they're covered."

Thanks in advance for your help!

 

[RyanB]

Ask your broker?

 

[denverpilot]

You have to ask. Never found any other good way to know for sure.

When I joined our Cessna co-ownership long ago, I needed 10 hours in type (man that’s long gone... hahaha) and I had some 182RG time. All in I had like 9 hours. (So annoying back then. Haha.)

We asked the insurance agent and she said it counted. For that policy.

The club’s 182 was down so I rented the 182RG for a couple more hours and that took care of it, without having to cause a price bump for the other co-owners or one that I would have paid for myself until it fell off.

Every insurer is different.

 

[Ravioli]

I'm curious what the answer will be, but the only answer that matters will come for your insurer. Seems to me a PA32 is the same regardless of 260 or 300. Both are CS props... one is fuel injected...

 

[catmandu]

Yep, ask the question of the provider, they are usually reasonable. Once it is in writing (email suffices), you are set.

 

[Paulie]

No matter what anyone tells you here you'd be insane not to ask the broker. The commenters are not going to pay to fix your bent airplane.

 

[N747JB]

It's funny how the insurance companies interpret make and model, my Conquest II time counted towards my Conquest I insurance as make and model, they are totally different airplanes, but 414A time wasn't counted towards 421B time and the 421B wasn't good for a 421C! So, call and ask!

 

[frfly172]

When you apply for your policy,ask the agent exactly what make and model means.

 

[Hank S]

With some insurers, Mooney time is Mooney time. Some want turbo Mooney time to qualify for a turbo Mooney. Still other insurers want the same letter identifier, i.e., to fly an M20-F, they want to see time in an F model.

So you gotta ask, and get it in writing.

 

[jbarrass]

To pile on, you have to ask your insurance company to be sure. But common sense has a role too, a fixed gear Cessna 182 is substantially different (insurance wise) than a R/G 182.

My answer has always been:
Make: Piper,
Model: PA24.

So PA24-180, 250, and 260 all work, for my policy, with my insurance company.

 

[iamtheari]

When an insurance policy (did you read how it defines make and model?) is ambiguous, the ambiguity is generally resolved in favor of the reasonable expectations of the insured. But sometimes the insurance company’s lawyer tells the judge that only the insurance company gets to decide, after the fact, what ambiguous terms mean, and sometimes the judge agrees.

So if you have questions about what the policy means, you are safer asking the company ahead of time and getting their answer in writing than waiting until the judge ignores the law and interprets the policy how the company tells him to because, after all, they know their own policy better than you do.

But first, check the definitions in your policy to see if the answer is already there.

 

[coloradobluesky]

The answer, if it exists, is in the policy. You have to actually READ the insurance policy. I would say that if the planes in question have the SAME ICAO 4 letter/number ID, then they are the same. At least there is something WRITTEN DOWN, by and agency and its NOT ambiguous. But thats MY opinion. Others may differ. Is there a court case or FAA precedent?

 

[denverpilot]

To pile on, you have to ask your insurance company to be sure. But common sense has a role too, a fixed gear Cessna 182 is substantially different (insurance wise) than a R/G 182.

As I mentioned above, my insurer doesn’t think so. Their view is 182 of any sort is a 182.

But I also recommended the same thing above, asking the company you’re using or planning to use. And get it in writing.

 

[James331]

I would get that answer in a email and keep the email too.

Trust insurance people about the same as gas station sushi.

 

[iamtheari]

Trust insurance people about the same as gas station sushi.

You must not have much experience dealing with insurance people. A steady diet of nothing but gas station sushi is healthier than what the insurance industry feeds you.

 

[Buck Rizvi]

Contacted my insurance rep and they cut the Six-300 dual instruction requirement in half because I have over 10 hours of dual in the Six-260. At least something!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[gismo]

Every insurer is different.

You've got that right. I had one that considered any BE35 (any V-tail Bonanza including engines from 185-285 HP, manually controlled prop pitch vs hydraulic CS prop, radically different control and instrument layouts, six vs four seats, significant MGW variations, and more) to qualify as same make&model but time in a BE33 (straight tail Bonanza) with the exact same engine, seat configuration, panel layout, etc. as the covered airplane didn't count. Having flown many hours in both types I can honestly say that it's nearly impossible to tell the difference between them from the pilot's seat in the air or when taking off or landing.