NavWorx Shut Down

retpd2001

retpd2001

Line Up and Wait
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retpd2001
Just got this this email from Seattle Avionics which was doing the upgrades for Navworx:

Effective immediately. Dallas Avionics, Inc. has discontinued distribution and support for all NavWorx products.

All pre-orders for NavWorx products, repairs and upgrades received by Dallas Avionics, Inc. will be canceled effective immediately.

Over the past year, Dallas Avionics, Inc. has made every attempt to facilitate the success of NavWorx and support of their customers. Unfortunately, under the current conditions and outlook, we can no longer continue to provide this service.

While we are compassionate to your situation, please direct all further correspondence direct to NavWorx at:

NavWorx, Incorporated
3706 Big A Road
Rowlett, TX 75089
1-888-NAVWORX(628-9679)

Also, if you go to the Navworx site, it says they have ceased operations.
 
Is a class action suit against NavWorx for stranding customers a posibility?
 
Holy guacamole. They were the front runner for my ADSB plans for the RV.

I guess I've got 24 months to come up with an alternative.

What say @James331? I think you were looking at them seriously too.
 
Sure. Doubt if any money can be had though.

If they had any money they probably would have worked on getting a more suitable GPS vendor and possibly retro-fitting the units.
 
bnt83 said:
Apparently Jim's line "it doesn't have to be certified it only has to meet the specs" didn't work for them.
Click to expand...

Not even close. They did have a product for certificated aircraft.

While the "death to Navworx" crowd from the original issue seems to have been proven correct, we all lose in then end. One less expensive way to meet the rule is off the table at a time when EFIS and Autopilot from experimental heritage are offering lower cost alternatives to certificated aircraft owners.
 
Ravioli said:
Holy guacamole. They were the front runner for my ADSB plans for the RV.

I guess I've got 24 months to come up with an alternative.

What say @James331? I think you were looking at them seriously too.
Click to expand...

one word for you ravioli.....SKYVIEW.... the price tag only hurts for a while.....

bob
 
bnt83 said:
Apparently Jim's line "it doesn't have to be certified it only has to meet the specs" didn't work for them.
Click to expand...

actually it does work, the FAA has accepted that. It was just the way that they worked with the FAA that did them in. look at dynons GPS2020. it does not have the TSO but the FAA has accepted that it meets the TSO. they just didn't try to tell the FAA "IM DOING IT MY WAY, NOT YOURS"

bob
 
unsafervguy said:
one word for you ravioli.....SKYVIEW.... the price tag only hurts for a while.....
Click to expand...

You ain't just whistling dixie there. I've got my spreadsheet all worked out on upgrading from D-100 to either D-180 or Skyview. Time will tell.
 
Oy this sucks.

seems like there is value in the company that another company could pick up at fire sale or bankruptcy.

What are the next cheapest options for experimentals or certified?
 
Ravioli said:
You ain't just whistling dixie there. I've got my spreadsheet all worked out on upgrading from D-100 to either D-180 or Skyview. Time will tell.
Click to expand...

I went through the same decision process when I upgraded from steam gauges in the 4. in the end I felt it was worth the extra money to go with the skyview over the legacy series. After flying with the skyview for a couple of years now, I can say I am 110 % satisfied with my decision.

bob
 
FORANE said:
Oy this sucks.

seems like there is value in the company that another company could pick up at fire sale or bankruptcy.

What are the next cheapest options for experimentals or certified?
Click to expand...
I'm going with the Garmin GDL 82. $1,800.

Here's a screenshot I just grabbed from the NavWorx website. This is a real bummer for a lot of friends of mine who went with NavWorx.

navworx%20notice%20of%20ceased%20operations%2010-19-17_zpsweu9uw2v.jpg
 
retpd2001 said:
Just got this this email from Seattle Avionics which was doing the upgrades for Navworx:

Effective immediately. Dallas Avionics, Inc. has discontinued distribution and support for all NavWorx products.

All pre-orders for NavWorx products, repairs and upgrades received by Dallas Avionics, Inc. will be canceled effective immediately.

Over the past year, Dallas Avionics, Inc. has made every attempt to facilitate the success of NavWorx and support of their customers. Unfortunately, under the current conditions and outlook, we can no longer continue to provide this service.

While we are compassionate to your situation, please direct all further correspondence direct to NavWorx at:

NavWorx, Incorporated
3706 Big A Road
Rowlett, TX 75089
1-888-NAVWORX(628-9679)

Also, if you go to the Navworx site, it says they have ceased operations.
Click to expand...
I received it too. Any attorneys out there interested in filing a class action for all of us out here that Navworx is screwing?
 
Don MacVitie said:
I received it too. Any attorneys out there interested in filing a class action for all of us out here that Navworx is screwing?
Click to expand...

That would be throwing good money after bad... there are no winners here, only losers, and the losing will only increase the more time and money is spent on this. It's time to move on.
 
So is it navworx that really screwed everyone or is it moreso the FAA who said this GPS module doesn’t actually meet the CFR?
 
Don MacVitie said:
I received it too. Any attorneys out there interested in filing a class action for all of us out here that Navworx is screwing?
Click to expand...
So, you think there’s any blood left in that turnip? My guess is that Navworx has depleted all the reserves they had working through the events this year without any associated revenue.

I have no idea what a class action would do besides transfer money from pilots pockets to lawyers pockets.
 
FORANE said:
Oy this sucks.

seems like there is value in the company that another company could pick up at fire sale or bankruptcy.

What are the next cheapest options for experimentals or certified?
Click to expand...

Forane,

This is what i have been silently thinking for some time and it would not be the first time political leverage entered the equation to protect a manufacturer from being upstaged by an upstart. IMO, Navworks has an uphill battle not directly caused by the FAA's reluctance to accept their product but something another big manufacturer considers as a threat to their dominance. Sounds logical to me in light of GM and Ford agreeing the latter would not compete with GM's Suburban years ago. A few thousand bucks placed in the right pockets can work wonders influencing the administrations to give an upstart manufacturer a hard time and that I think that's what's happening with Navworks.

I will not name the companies I think are responsible for that. i can only surmise their objective is to put them out of business.
 
Don MacVitie said:
I received it too. Any attorneys out there interested in filing a class action for all of us out here that Navworx is screwing?
Click to expand...

My read of the situation is that the FAA moved the goal line and NavWorx got caught up in a "Lucy, Charlie Brown, and a football" type scenario, where they were lead to believe they met the rule(s), and the rules were re-interpreted and not in their favor. Then, Navworx' owner fired a public shot over the bow of the FAA, which ain't a good choice when you're playing with your time and money and the FAA is A) Angered and B) Playing with house money.

I think the FAA is more culpable here than Navworx, but you're not gonna win a suit against the FAA...
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
https://www.uavionix.com/

They seem to be working on solutions for type certificated aircraft, but ain't there yet in the U.S.
Click to expand...

That's the route I'm taking. $1500 or thereabouts for the Echo in/out unit, an approved GPS and an antenna. I like this solution because it plays nice with my GRT EFIS and I can use my existing Garmin 327 transponder.
 
FORANE said:
What are the next cheapest options for experimentals or certified?
Click to expand...

For me, for the time being, the cheapest solution is to "Just Say No!" When the government gets it's s#1T straight, I'll revisit the issue. Never been an early adopter for just this reason.


37092571754_967766ea65.jpg
 
kyleb said:
Then, Navworx' owner fired a public shot over the bow of the FAA, which ain't a good choice when you're playing with your time and money and the FAA is A) Angered and B) Playing with house money.
Click to expand...

As soon as I saw a letter titled “THE FAA SABOTAGED OUR BUSINESS” on the front page of Navworx’s website, I knew their goose was cooked. Even if the FAA had the grace to overlook this overture, it displayed a stunning lack of business acumen from a manufacturer wishing to work in the field of certified avionics.

You have to keep your head on a swivel when you buy one-off products from small mfgrs, but come on, man. That sinking ship’s smoke plume was visible on the distant horizon.
 
Ryan F. said:
As soon as I saw a letter titled “THE FAA SABOTAGED OUR BUSINESS” on the front page of Navworx’s website, I knew their goose was cooked. Even if the FAA had the grace to overlook this overture, it displayed a stunning lack of business acumen from a manufacturer wishing to work in the field of certified avionics.
Click to expand...

As George Kennedy's character, Dragline, said in Cool Hand Luke:

"He ain't in the box because of the joke played on him. He back-sassed a free man. They got their rules."
 
Ryan F. said:
That would be throwing good money after bad... there are no winners here, only losers, and the losing will only increase the more time and money is spent on this. It's time to move on.
Click to expand...

From what I can tell, the software is good. The design is good. The only real issue is the GPS unit. A new guy might be able to come in, snag the intellectual assets, get a compliant GPS and sell the units without having to take on the debt burden that NavWorx has built up.
 
They are the Volkswagen of avionics and why they make engineers take an ethics class in college.
 
Norman said:
Forane,

This is what i have been silently thinking for some time and it would not be the first time political leverage entered the equation to protect a manufacturer from being upstaged by an upstart. IMO, Navworks has an uphill battle not directly caused by the FAA's reluctance to accept their product but something another big manufacturer considers as a threat to their dominance. Sounds logical to me in light of GM and Ford agreeing the latter would not compete with GM's Suburban years ago. A few thousand bucks placed in the right pockets can work wonders influencing the administrations to give an upstart manufacturer a hard time and that I think that's what's happening with Navworks.

I will not name the companies I think are responsible for that. i can only surmise their objective is to put them out of business.
Click to expand...
While I don't know what happened in this case, or whether the system were used that way..... It is a time-honored technique for companies to use laws, rules, and regulations to build barriers that keep out newcomers. It is also why some companies and industries ask for regulation at the Federal level - to be able to control the regulations to their advantage. It is why we will never see elimination of regulatory agencies. I'll stop there - I know you understand where I am going with this.
 
I have this to say. I was on the CPA group by and put in $199 down payment for a unit. This was right before the drama started. The down payment was listed as refundable. My payment was sent by paypal. When the FAA started up I requested my refund. I paid the payment on 9-16 and requested a refund on 10-29. I was told by Bill Moffitt to contact him if I did not see the refund by that Friday. On 11-13 I emailed saying I did not see the refund. On 11-14 I was sent a message by Bill saying his records showed they had refunded the money on 11-2 and then sent a screen shot showing the transaction where I paid them. I immediately said the screen shot did not show a refund and asked for a transaction number so my bank could track it. Over the next month I tried several times to contact Bill and the well meaning CPA member who set up the group buy. The well meaning member sent Bill another email with it CCed to me. I never received a response. By the time I went to my bank they said I was past the time period for a dispute. I am a police officer for a living and the idiotic "evidence" given by Moffitt and the total lack of any communication show they knew my money was not refunded and they had no intention of refunding it. I can dealt with an honest answer of "we don't have the money to refund you deposit right now". Again I do not thing the well meaning CPA member was anything but honest. In fact he sent an apology to the entire list of group buy members and that is more than I got from NAVWORX direct.
I also have to say. You can't sue and get any money from a company that is closed and worth nothing. In my case it is better to write off the $199 to just move on. For the folks who have a NAVWORX unit and have much more money into it I think you would do better to spend the money you would have spent on legal fees to pay for another ADSB solution.
 
Unfortunately, another case of "take the money and run". Seen it before in aviation and computer products. At least with Kickstarter you know the risk going in.

Once BK is filed, an unsecured creditor goes pretty much to the end of the list.
 
wsuffa said:
Unfortunately, another case of "take the money and run". Seen it before in aviation and computer products. At least with Kickstarter you know the risk going in.
Click to expand...

That usually occurs when there is no real product to sell.

I think this one is different. They had a product, and a manufacturing supply chain, and appeared to be in it for the long haul.

Once they decided to kick back at the FAA (and that judgement is debatable) their revenue stream was removed.

Salaries and expenses don’t stop getting paid out, however. Having the FAA come down a second time over third party certification appears to have rung the financial death bell.
 
Reminder to all you litigious clowns:
1. You can't squeeze blood from a turnip.
2. The only winners in class action are attorneys!
 
The employee I bought my unit from said on the Navworx Facebook page the 3rd party supplier representing the 2.0 position sensor as compliant was Aspen. Not sure what to make of all this, except it it just all stinks.

There's 800 of us in this boat. I wonder how much of a discount we can get on a couple hundred NexNav mini's.
 
Chip Sylverne said:
There's 800 of us in this boat. I wonder how much of a discount we can get on a couple hundred NexNav mini's.
Click to expand...

I think they're almost $2k and it would obsolete on you if the ADS600-B ever fails (since there will be no Navworx to fix it). So to me, the better play would be to install a used 430W and get a great radio and navigator to boot. Then, when the ADS600-B eventually breaks, another manufacturer's ADS-B product will be able to use the 430W as a position source and you'll be back up and running fairly cheap.
 
I bought the system last month with the intent to connect to my GTN650 for the WAAS input, was assured that all was well, so I am out two grand.
How can the FAA allow some systems like the Echo UAT to be used in Light sport and experimental aircraft but not in certificated aircraft when we all share the same airspace? How stupid! I have requested my bank to open a dispute and see if I can recover my money, it was paid to Dallas Avionics. Not holding my breath though.
 
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