Training Budget for helicopter rating?

AggieMike88

AggieMike88

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The original "I don't know it all" of aviation.
We have a general consensus that the budget for a PPL Fixed Wing is about 9 to 10 AMU's.

The FlightChops video posted about his ride on the Coast Guard helo and his mention of obtaining his rotary PPL had me wondering about cost.

If a fixed wing pilot was to seek his rotary ticket, what is a good budget to work with?


(and before the crowd asks, yeah, sorta curious about doing it.)
 
AggieMike88 said:
If a fixed wing pilot was to seek his rotary ticket, what is a good budget to work with?
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For an existing fixed wing pilot?
Double the budget than what it would cost to train a newb.
Remember, you gotta first "unlearn" how to fly a plane and then learn how to fly a rotary wing. :D
 
Depending on the area you're looking at about ~$10k I'd say for the add-on. I'm doing mine right now.

 
BigBadLou said:
For an existing fixed wing pilot?
Double the budget than what it would cost to train a newb.
Remember, you gotta first "unlearn" how to fly a plane and then learn how to fly a rotary wing. :D
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Not true, I picked up on it real quick, was able to hover relatively well in the first half hour or so. And we've spent the past 20hrs just exploring and honing in skills.
 
Oh I heard around 25-30K for a PPL. Mine was around $1,000,000...in taxes.;)

Oh, add on. Yeah about 10 grand.
 
When I called Sevier County Choppers for an estimate, the R22 rate they quoted me was 300$/hr., which translates to 12-15k for the rating.
 
Private add on or initial ?
yes it matters.

What kind of helicopter ?
yes it matters, you cannot solo a Robinson helicopter until you have received 20 hours dual per SFAR 73

Also depends a lot on how you were taught initially. I did my PSEL with the full intent doing my PRH as an add on with a dual rated instructor who was well versed in doing add-ons. Its as simple as when learning "you put whatever amount of pedal in necessary to keep the nose straight" vs "add right pedal for power(airplane)" or "add left pedal for power(most American helicopters)"

So what's the intent of your mission and what helicopter you use make a huge difference on what your costs may be.

Using my own first hand experience, I did a Private add-on and Commercial Helicopter in a Bell 47. I finished both certificates near the respective minimum helicopter required times.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
I would also recommend flying a Hughes 269c /Schweitzer 300 over the r22.
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While I agree with the sentiment, they are getting as hard to find as a Bell 47 thanks to Sikorsky - Lockheed now owns it, haven't seen any plans to bring it back from the dead. This coming from a Schweizer fan who did his Heli Instrument in the 300 and who's initial instructor flew the most famous 300 in the world

I very luckily logged some hours in 7505B before Roger retired.
 
I would highly recommend Mountain Ridge Helicopters in Logan, UT if you can travel there. My son is following in my footsteps (yikes), and is now getting his CFI after completing PVT/INST and COM there, great school recommended by an old friend who is a DPE. Please tell them I sent you. Glenn
 
All of your $$$. Last I heard local dual in an R44 was about $450/hour.
 
As someone who has done the heli rating add-on, here is the way I see it.

If you fly 2 lessons a day minimum all the way to the rating, you can get it done in $15k.
If you fly 2 lessons a week (or less), it could run you over $20k.

If you want the lowest cost, learn in a R-22, and find a good school that charges <$300/hr dual.
You might hear that it's easier to learn in a R-44 or a Schweizer, which is true, but it's a lot more expensive per hour, and in my opinion (having flown all of the above) you'll be a better pilot if you start with the R-22 and then transition as needed.

And it is true that a fixed wing pilot has to unlearn some instincts/reflexes, but IMO it's not as bad as some make it out to be.

A few other things to bear in mind. Even if you are completely committed and want to eat-sleep-fly-eat-sleep-fly nonstop, your flight time will likely be limited by equipment, weather and instructor availability. This would vary from place to place, but true just about everywhere. And what counts for total cost for the rating is the bottom line hours you manage to get per week.
Also, you need a bunch of solo hours, including cross country. There is some question whether they are needed under part 141, but my experience is with part 61 schools and I would think getting a rating without solo experience is ludicrous (and dangerous).
(I personally got well above the minimum solo needed because I thought it was fun and would make me a better pilot and more confident for the checkride.)
 
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Thanks for the info. At the moment, it's still a bit of a dream. And in this dream, I keep hearing folks yelling at me, "Hogg! You get away from that thing!"

 
jaybee said:
I very luckily logged some hours in 7505B before Roger retired.
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Did he fully retire altogether? I knew he retired from the airshow circuit. Met him over breakfast at KGJT a few years ago. Super nice guy.
 
Depends on how quick you pick it up, of course. Expect 40-60 hours at $250-500/hr, depending on what you chose to fly.
  • Nothing wrong with flying a Robinson. The R44 is a wonderful machine to learn in.
  • The R22 isn't the perfect trainer, but it's just fine if you know what you're doing. They're a popular trainer because they're cheap.
  • Hughes/Schweizer/Sikorsky 269/300 is a good, stable machine, but more complex (expensive) and far less efficient than a Robinson. It's time has come and gone.
  • I don't know much about the Enstroms, but some people love them.
  • Cabri G2 is the new kid on the block. Very cool machine, and plenty of performance at low altitudes. Not very common in the US, yet.
 
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jaybee said:
What kind of helicopter ?
yes it matters, you cannot solo a Robinson helicopter until you have received 20 hours dual per SFAR 73
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Those 20hrs count for all robinson helos, right ?

Might as well get the 20hrs out of the way during primary training. Unless you buy a non-robinson helo, that's probably all that is available these days anyway.
 
RotorDude said:
If you want the lowest cost, learn in a R-22, and find a good school that charges <$300/hr dual.
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Just for a price point. American Helicopters in Manassas, VA lists dual in the R22 at $270/hr with 10% discount on 10hr blocks. They seem to be quite active, probably mostly veterans administration business.
 
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weilke said:
Those 20hrs count for all robinson helos, right ?

Might as well get the 20hrs out of the way during primary training. Unless you buy a non-robinson helo, that's probably all that is available these days anyway.
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without looking it up and going off memory - you can only count XXX hour of the 22 towards the 44 but not the other way around or something like that - there is a couple different hour required rules in the SFAR
 
jaybee said:
without looking it up and going off memory - you can only count XXX hour of the 22 towards the 44 but not the other way around or something like that - there is a couple different hour required rules in the SFAR
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Thanks.

As for the original question: All of it.
 
weilke said:
Just for a price point. American Helicopters in Manassas, VA lists dual in the R22 at $270/hr with 10% discount on 10hr blocks. They seem to be quite active, probably mostly veterans administration business.
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Yes, that's a good price. After you get your rating in the R22, you can get the R44 rating (technically "endorsement") in 5 hours even, in a concentrated R22-R44 transition course at East Coast Aero Club at KBED for $359/hr dual-wet. I did my transition there, and was able to get signed off in the minimum time. They also have a low-rate lodging deal with a local motel (be sure to ask about it).
Also highly recommended after you get your rating is the Robinson Factory Safety Course at Torrance, CA. Just the factory tour alone is worth it, almost. :)
 
Ditto on the Robbie Factory course, for the cost of one hour of flight time you get -
  • one hour of flight time !
  • fed lunch three times (good food too)
  • three days of ground instruction
  • factory tour
  • permanent PIC endorsement instead of the temporary one (might be some hour caveats to that... getting CRS as I get older)
  • if you did your CFI in a 22 and then fly the 44 at the factory you will get your endorsement to instruct in the 44 - a lot of people pay the DPE for two checkrides, if you got to go to the factory anyhow.... (again hour requirements etc etc)
all in all I think it was the best 500 bucks I've spent in a while, plus good luck finding a school to hire you or rent you a Robbie without having gone to the factory course
 
Wow, there is a free lunch !
 
jaybee said:
Ditto on the Robbie Factory course, for the cost of one hour of flight time you get -
  • one hour of flight time !
  • fed lunch three times (good food too)
  • three days of ground instruction
  • factory tour
  • permanent PIC endorsement instead of the temporary one (might be some hour caveats to that... getting CRS as I get older)
  • if you did your CFI in a 22 and then fly the 44 at the factory you will get your endorsement to instruct in the 44 - a lot of people pay the DPE for two checkrides, if you got to go to the factory anyhow.... (again hour requirements etc etc)
all in all I think it was the best 500 bucks I've spent in a while, plus good luck finding a school to hire you or rent you a Robbie without having gone to the factory course
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Agree with the above, plus:
  • You get an insurance discount for the factory course and Wings endorsement
  • It's recommended for both instructors and PPLs
  • You can buy neat Robbie gear there (if you are into that stuff)
  • You meet lots of cool folks there from all over the world who are all helinuts like you :)
  • You can discuss safety and design issues directly with the factory experts
 
ah yea I did use that for WINGS and also if you are CFI up for renewal it counts for that also
 
AggieMike88 said:
We have a general consensus that the budget for a PPL Fixed Wing is about 9 to 10 AMU's.
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No we don't. Maybe in an inflated metroplex area, but the majority of the country isn't that.
 
Just got a Boatpix advert in the mail today. They need tour pilots! :D
 
camel said:
This place in Arkansas is advertising R44 training time (including instructor) for $380/hr, if you buy a 10 hour block. Or $400/hr for a 5 hour block. Here's the link:
http://www.arhelicopters.com/services-2/flight-instruction/

For comparison, at Mauna Loa Helicopters in Hawaii, R44 dual time is $535/hour. And for the record, I think I'd choose Hawaii over Arkansas.
http://www.maunaloahelicopters.com/cost-of-helicopter-pilot-training/
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This place in Massachusetts (KBED) offers R44 dual training for $379/hr (cash/check/debit, or $10 extra for CC), with no block committment required.
And from personal experience, they have a meticulously maintained fleet and excellent instructors.
Highly recommended if you want R44, though as I mentioned above, you can do much better by starting with R22 for ~$100/hr less and transitioning to R44 after you get rated.
 
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AggieMike88 said:
We have a general consensus that the budget for a PPL Fixed Wing is about 9 to 10 AMU's.

The FlightChops video posted about his ride on the Coast Guard helo and his mention of obtaining his rotary PPL had me wondering about cost.

If a fixed wing pilot was to seek his rotary ticket, what is a good budget to work with?


(and before the crowd asks, yeah, sorta curious about doing it.)
Click to expand...
All it takes is all you got
 
Wow... You DO still exist! Where ya been? Still doing the gliders?
 
AggieMike88 said:
Thanks for the info. At the moment, it's still a bit of a dream. And in this dream, I keep hearing folks yelling at me, "Hogg! You get away from that thing!"
Click to expand...
I did it, back in the 1990s. I was smart and didn't keep track of the cost, but I would say it was easily the most expensive training I have paid for myself. Aside from a few rides I gave to friends and co-workers, I didn't make use of it, but it was fun and interesting. I thought briefly about going the helicopter route but I already had so much fixed wing time that I went the other way instead.
 
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RotorDude said:
This place in Massachusetts (KBED) offers R44 dual training for $379/hr
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They offered me the opportunity to interview for a helicopter CFI position. They said they can hire foreign pilots who need to build the hours before their visa expires and would do it for free, so they were only going to pay minimum wage, literally minimum wage. I appreciate that they were willing to extend the offer, but I decided to look elsewhere.
 
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