Questions to ask when selecting a CFI?

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f3d

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f3d
This may be a luxury, but I'm having a tough time deciding which of the two CFI's I've now flown with I should continue flying with towards my PPL.

TL;DR - they have different methods of teaching despite same school/syllabus however I get along fine and am productive as a student with both. One will eventually go to the airlines, the other just loves to fly in addition to his career. Schedule is a problem for me and they seem to switch off months of being relatively booked up at this school. I also now feel strange going back to the first (though at the end of the day i dont care about flip flopping so long as I can continue with one of them). What additional things am I not thinking of that should help me decide? What should I be asking both to gain insight into how the rest of my training will go?

Long story:
I started taking lessons for my PPL back in '94 when I was just in 5th grade. I built up about 23hrs and then at the same time, I both realized I was a long way from being of age to solo and I started HS (girls, cars, sports, etc distractions).

I'm now much older, have a newborn son, wife, etc... but after taking an "intro flight" around Kauai with a CFI there (he was awesome) in lieu of a helicopter sightseeing ride, I've got the bug again - and no good reason not to finish my PPL and keep flying (something I love).

I had a friend recommend a school out on Long Island (I live in Brooklyn), and got paired up with the first CFI. He's a younger guy (CFI/I/multi/etc) and is a confident teacher. We hit it off and after a few flights that were spaced out by a month (both due to my and his schedule) i started looking at his availability to make much more frequent flights. Between his schedule and mine, we never seemed to jive - so I ended up with long periods between flights.

I called the school and discussed this with them, they set me up with another CFI who isnt a career CFI (I wouldnt call him lesser qualified). He was just as confident if not more, a teacher. My second CFI I just had a flight with today and we did the intro type of dance... cut through some basics see if I'll kill him or not. Felt good overall, but I was a bit more tense in the air and it showed every step of the way. Not sure if it was his more formal nature or that I was bringing along and using a kneeboard and foreflight for the first time (total distraction - I should have stuck to paper).

Im now 3 hrs into my (re)training, and want to pick one to fly with consistently, especially given their differences in teaching methods.

What should I be thinking about to weigh the pros/cons of each CFI and what questions should I be asking them to help me pick one to move forward with?

(first time posting here - sorry if this is a dead horse on the training forum I'm coming in fresh to beat on)
-Cheers
 
It's your choice ,go with the one that uses a teaching style you are comfortable with. Also insure that they will be there through your training up to the test. good Luck.
 
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Both are probably OK, so it's on you to choose. But you do want a CFI to teach you, guide you, and make you a safe and competent pilot. It's definitely not a popularity contest but you want to be able to express your concerns and any complaints with him/her, get along with, and not feel intimidated by. I'd try to go with one that can get you 2 lessons a week if you can afford that. Long lapses between flights ends up costing you more $$$ because you end up repeating part or the whole previous lesson. My experience as a CFI is 2 or more lessons a week will get you through it quicker and at a less expense. Good luck!
 
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frfly172 said:
It's your choice ,go with the one that uses a teaching style you are comfortable with. Also insure that they will be there through your training up to the test. good Luck.
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I agree. Try them both out and see which one you click with. FWIW I've seen "experienced" CFIs who sucked at teaching and "new" CFIs who were awesome as well as the other way around. If no one gave me chance as a new CFI with 280 hours I would have never gained experience and I'm grateful for my students that took me on as their CFI. I have a 100% pass rate so I guess I did something right!
 
You said they are different, but you get along with both just fine. So it pretty much comes down to: Which one fits your schedule best?

You've already done the hard part, finding a good match for their teaching methods and your learning methods. That's the biggest thing. After that, the CFI that's going to be able to give you consistent training opportunities is the one to use.
 
I agree with all the previous replies, but would like to weigh in -
If the Airline-bound CFI has any chance on getting shipped off to an airline job, I wouldn't even consider him. Last thing you want is to be solo'ed, and nearing your checkride to find that you have to switch instructors (and re-learn things his way).
Other points that I have heard people mention in conversation (and agree with) were things like:
- Choose someone whose personality jives with yours; someone who you would invite over for dinner.
- Not all good CFIs are good teachers.
- Make sure he has a very good grasp on weather, and can explain it to you in a way that works. Local weather is a must, but him also understanding weather trends that you might find on a long cross country are very helpful. Remember, you are getting your certificate to be able to Fly Places. Mountains, Florida, etc.
- How many times has he been to Oshkosh and/or sun-n-fun? You want an instructor that is passionate.
- If all else fails, go with the skinnier, better smelling one!

I planned to fly 3x a week during my private training, and averaged about 2.5 flights/week. Without having anything else to compare it to, I would say that either flying more or less often would have been detrimental.

Congrats!
If you are anywhere near Brookhaven, then I can make a personal recommendation.
 
I look for CFIs who are already ATPs, keeps the hour builder and dash types out, gold seal is a plus, of course having a teaching style you mesh with is golden.
 
@James331 an old flight instructor (who has a gold seal) recently pointed out to me that there's nothing required to keep the gold seal and the instructor may not have met the requirements for decades.

The guy mentioning it passed 54 advanced rating students in his last CFI renewal. His gold seal is as gold as a friend of his, who's not passed a student in decades and renews his CFI online, he pointed out.

I'm just passing his opinion of them on.
 
This is true, heck it's been a couple years since my last recommend, the gold seal does show two things though.

One, and one point their performance was that of a gold seal

Two, and the big one for me, they have the personality that drives them to go the extra mile to get all the requirments and go to the FSDO for a addon which gives them zero added privileges, basically they like to rise to a challenge and/or be the best CFI they can be.
 
Also how organized is the CFI? Do they use a syllabus and lesson plan outline and handouts? I found most CFI were very disorganized and just want to jump in the plane without any ground briefing before and after the flight. The two guys I am considering for my IFR rating have actually written training guides/books for teaching students that they use which is big plus compared to most CFI.
 
All other things being equal, I would opt for the CFI who has significant out-of-the-pattern experience. One who has flown long distances to disparate locations rather than one whose career thus far has been limited to instruction.

Bob Gardner
 
James331 said:
This is true, heck it's been a couple years since my last recommend, the gold seal does show two things though.

One, and one point their performance was that of a gold seal

Two, and the big one for me, they have the personality that drives them to go the extra mile to get all the requirments and go to the FSDO for a addon which gives them zero added privileges, basically they like to rise to a challenge and/or be the best CFI they can be.
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The "performance" is simply that they had ten students in two years time, maybe long ago, and passed 80% of them, which is only barely a "B" letter grade. ;)

Most of the CFIs at the puppy mills qualify, if you think about it. Some are good. Some... Well. You know. And they get to keep it for life as long as they never forget to renew.

But I do see your point that most of them won't make a phone call and take an hour to walk a form into the FSDO to get their new colored FAA logo.

I wouldn't balk at doing the paperwork to get one if the numbers made it possible someday, but it's mostly a measure of bulk, not quality.

It'd be better if it was a rolling indication of a higher than 90%+ pass rate that fell off if the pass rate fell below the threshold. There's problems with that idea, too.
 
Well you also need to get a ground instructor ticket and the FSDO really does go through their database on you, so it's not quite just a phone call and a quick hop in the FSDO, little bit of a pain in the arse factor.

For me it's really just look inside the CFIs personality type, also shows that the person isn't, or wasn't just a super part time hobby CFI.
 
James331 said:
Well you also need to get a ground instructor ticket and the FSDO really does go through their database on you, so it's not quite just a phone call and a quick hop in the FSDO, little bit of a pain in the arse factor.

For me it's really just look inside the CFIs personality type, also shows that the person isn't, or wasn't just a super part time hobby CFI.
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Once. That's the problem with it. Could very easily be a "super part-time hobby CFI" now and have worked at a school thirty years ago that wanted everyone who qualified to go get it for marketing purposes.
 
I started my training in the spring with a promotion for a flat fee garanteeing the private rating at the end . I met the instructor at the ground school course a local college was giving, a six week course. Who ended being my instructor was a guest speaker at the class hawking Piper s promotion. He had just got out of college and was slated to go to navy jet school in the fall through the ROTC program and made no bones that he would just be instructing through the summer. We were close to the same age and seemed to hit it off in the after class meet and greet.. The next week I signed up and he was awesome! I schedule 2 sometimes three lessons a week through part of the summer. He worked for the FBO and on accasion he would be asked to fly somewhere to pick up parts for a plane they were working on. He would call me and if I was available I would only be charged for half of whatever time we flew. Was taught cross country this way. I had a few hours I had from a few years earlier and he signed me off for the check ride after 36 hours with him. The check ride was fun and I had my certificate! Because I didn t need the full requirement from the promotion I was allowed the use of a nearly new Piper Archer for the rest of the summer. Awesome instructor, awesome deal! So yes, pick the instructor you have the best repoire with, it will make it more fun, and you never know what other benefits you may get! (And yes he did fly jets for the Navy when all was said and done)
 
bobmrg said:
All other things being equal, I would opt for the CFI who has significant out-of-the-pattern experience. One who has flown long distances to disparate locations rather than one whose career thus far has been limited to instruction.

Bob Gardner
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This!

A CFI can't teach you what he doesn't know. This is fairly important for the PPL but critical for the instrument rating. There is theory and there is the real world. When you're done training, the time for theory is mostly over and you will be flying in the real world. So you need to be ready.

IIRC it is possible to get a CFII having landed at only three airports and never having flown in a cloud. Do you want this guy as a teacher? Better the ATP, as someone has already recommended, or at least someone who has significant time in the real world as Bob recommends. For "significant" I would say 1000+ hours not including dual-given.
 
"Are you skilled enough to save my ass when I try to kill us?"
 
Do you put any stock in the AOPA Training Excellence awards for Schools/Instructors?
 
Honestly, from what you describe, either will do fine.

But if you really want something arbitrary, buy him a burrito and take him up,to 10,000 for some high altitude air work. If you can stand the smell, he's a keeper.
 
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