[NA] 1999 VW Passat ?'s

[CJones]

About a year ago, we bought a 1999 VW Passat for my wife's "new" car. It had right at 100k miles on it at the time, but the engine had a hiccup early in its life which resulted in a full-rebuild so the engine basically had 70k on it.

ANYWHO.. Within the past few months, a few minor glitches have started popping up and I thought I'd post here to see if anyone might have more experience with 'dem for'n cars.

1.) At random times, a buzzing sound will come from the dash apparently behind the 'hazard flashers' button. If I press the button in slightly, the noise will stop, but if I let off the button it will buzz randomly. There isn't any rhyme or reason to when or why the noise starts. Turn signals/flashers work correctly. I'm *thinking* that maybe the flasher relay is shorting out somehow. Any ideas?

2.) The parking "BRAKE" light will come on and an alarm will sound when I drive across a bump in the road (RR crossing, pot hole, etc.). At first it took a pretty stiff bump to make the alarm sound, but recently the bumps that set the alarm off have been getting smaller and smaller. I'm *thinking* it might be a simple pressure switch somewhere in the parking brake system that is wearing out and activating the alarm when jolted. Any ideas?

3.) Within the past few months, the rear tires have started 'roaring' while going down the road. When my wife took it to the dealer for the oil change a couple of weeks ago, they said "There's something wrong with the tires. We don't know what it is, but something just isn't right. We can sell you new ones for $400". They are Michelin tires with a 40k mile warranty from Costco (previous owner put new tires on it) and we currently have ~45k miles on the tires. I had noticed the increased noise while driving before the mechanic said something about it, but now I can't help but notice it. Today, on the 2.5 hr drive back from my parents' house, I noticed that the car seems to 'jump' a little from side to side even when driving on new smooth asphalt. All I can think of is that maybe the rear end has gone out of alignment (if possible). I haven't inspected the rear tires yet to check for uneven wear. Any ideas on this one?

Thanks for any and all advice people may have with this. So far, I only have experience with working on my 94 GMC Pickup, so I'm a little leery of simply tearing into this VW car.

 

[SCCutler]

First off, I'd look into the flasher thing first; what you describe sounds much like a flasher or, perhaps, a bad relay. The fact that cycling the flasher switch makes the noise stop certainly supports this hypothesis, but one would need to study the car's wiring diagram to draw an educated conclusion.

Brakes? Brake caution lights are either (1) parking brake; (2) unequal pressure between the two braking circuits, or (3) ABS system failure. I bet on 2, but since it occurs when you are not even braking, you should first check for a loose connector or chafing wire in a pressure sensor.

As for the tires / alignment, while it is hypothetically possible that the rear end could be misaligned, it is improbable. The tires making a lot of noise (and I presume that you have ruled-out bearings) could easily be internal failure of the tires' structure, which could easily have the effect of both noise and squirrely handling (from unequal rolling resistance). I would not let it carry on, as this condition is also usually accompanied by significantly higher tire temperatures from friction.

You have gotten your money's worth out of the tires- it was me, I'd buy new tires for the fronts, move the fronts to the back, and see what you have.

I have, by the way, experienced precisely what you describe- the noise and odd handling. It was a front tire, and I was absolutely convinced I had severe front end trouble on my Audi. New tires made it a new car.

 

[KennyFlys]

If the Passat is anywhere close to the Jetta, it may be affected by the same service issue regarding the signals. There was a recall last year on them. I have the same issue but haven't taken it in for repair. If it applies, it's a free repair.

As Spike mentioned, I'm betting on a loose switch fastener for the E-brake's light actuation switch.

How is the tread on the tires? Is it wearing smooth and evenly? No cupping? If the tread appears good, the bearing may be going bad. At some point, a bad bearing will cause the tire to begin to wear unevenly.

I've never used expensive tires. The last few sets have been Uniroyal Tiger Paws at $52 each. The warranty is 70k but I've gotten about 55k, mainly because I've rotated them only twice. If I rotated at the regular interval of 3000 miles, I'd be doing it every two weeks or more frequent. For the price and life, I'm quite happy.

I've had four VW Jettas; 98, 99, 00 and 04. I've never had to replace the rear bearings but there may come a time soon. Brakes are another story entirely! Autozone is my friend!

 

[JRitt]

On the Brake light, It sounds like the switch on the emergency brake. Disconnect one wire (and tape it). See if the problem goes away.

On the tire roar rotate the tires and if the problem stays on the rear you probably have a rear wheel bearing going out (easy and cheap to replace)

 

[gismo]

1.) At random times, a buzzing sound will come from the dash apparently behind the 'hazard flashers' button. If I press the button in slightly, the noise will stop, but if I let off the button it will buzz randomly. There isn't any rhyme or reason to when or why the noise starts. Turn signals/flashers work correctly. I'm *thinking* that maybe the flasher relay is shorting out somehow. Any ideas?

Is the buzzing related at all to the engine RPM? There's lots of things that can buzz when the resonate with the engine.

2.) The parking "BRAKE" light will come on and an alarm will sound when I drive across a bump in the road (RR crossing, pot hole, etc.). At first it took a pretty stiff bump to make the alarm sound, but recently the bumps that set the alarm off have been getting smaller and smaller. I'm *thinking* it might be a simple pressure switch somewhere in the parking brake system that is wearing out and activating the alarm when jolted. Any ideas?

The parking brake switch is in the center armrest under the parking brake handle. I have had times when something prevented the handle from getting all the way down. You can easily check on how far the handle must be raised to turn the light on and if it's really close to the down position, I think you may be able to "adjust" the switch.

IIRC there may be a level sensor in the brake fluid reservoir. If so it could be bad or the fluid could be low. I also think there's a different warning that shows up if there's a more significant problem with the brakes or ABS (like an ABS lite comes on).

3.) Within the past few months, the rear tires have started 'roaring' while going down the road. When my wife took it to the dealer for the oil change a couple of weeks ago, they said "There's something wrong with the tires. We don't know what it is, but something just isn't right. We can sell you new ones for $400". They are Michelin tires with a 40k mile warranty from Costco (previous owner put new tires on it) and we currently have ~45k miles on the tires. I had noticed the increased noise while driving before the mechanic said something about it, but now I can't help but notice it. Today, on the 2.5 hr drive back from my parents' house, I noticed that the car seems to 'jump' a little from side to side even when driving on new smooth asphalt. All I can think of is that maybe the rear end has gone out of alignment (if possible). I haven't inspected the rear tires yet to check for uneven wear. Any ideas on this one?

Unless the car was bent in an accident, I think it's unlikely the rear suspension is significantly out of alignment and that's not likely to cause much tire noise anyway. Another possibility is a wheel bearing and this can easily be checked for when the car's on a lift (just spin the tires and listen for a noise that varies in pitch with RPM). Most likely it is the tires, I've noticed that many tires made today tend to get a lot louder as they wear. Typically, tire noise will vary with the road surface, getting louder on concrete and quieter on fresh asphalt. Have you checked the tire inflation?

 

[Ghery]

The parking brake switch is in the center armrest under the parking brake handle. I have had times when something prevented the handle from getting all the way down. You can easily check on how far the handle must be raised to turn the light on and if it's really close to the down position, I think you may be able to "adjust" the switch.

Now that you mention that, I recall having a similar issue with a 1974 Subaru that we had many (many, many) years ago. The light would come on and I'd just bump the parking brake handle and the light would go out. Once I knew what it was I wasn't about to spend money getting it fixed. Needed that money for the engine rebuilds every 50,000 miles when the head gaskets blew. Sleeved cylinders, resting on crush washers in the base of the block. To replace head gaskets meant a total engine tear down. And listening to a car repair show in the radio on Saturday (Japanese auto specialsts) it sounds like they forgot the fix a few years ago as there is a recall in place for 03-05 models. Wrong guy must have retired.

 

[CJones]

First off, I'd look into the flasher thing first; what you describe sounds much like a flasher or, perhaps, a bad relay. The fact that cycling the flasher switch makes the noise stop certainly supports this hypothesis, but one would need to study the car's wiring diagram to draw an educated conclusion.

Brakes? Brake caution lights are either (1) parking brake; (2) unequal pressure between the two braking circuits, or (3) ABS system failure. I bet on 2, but since it occurs when you are not even braking, you should first check for a loose connector or chafing wire in a pressure sensor.

As for the tires / alignment, while it is hypothetically possible that the rear end could be misaligned, it is improbable. The tires making a lot of noise (and I presume that you have ruled-out bearings) could easily be internal failure of the tires' structure, which could easily have the effect of both noise and squirrely handling (from unequal rolling resistance). I would not let it carry on, as this condition is also usually accompanied by significantly higher tire temperatures from friction.

You have gotten your money's worth out of the tires- it was me, I'd buy new tires for the fronts, move the fronts to the back, and see what you have.

I have, by the way, experienced precisely what you describe- the noise and odd handling. It was a front tire, and I was absolutely convinced I had severe front end trouble on my Audi. New tires made it a new car.

Thanks!

 

[CJones]

If the Passat is anywhere close to the Jetta, it may be affected by the same service issue regarding the signals. There was a recall last year on them. I have the same issue but haven't taken it in for repair. If it applies, it's a free repair.

Hmm.. Never got a letter from anyone about a recall, but we just bought the car last June, so it's possible it was on the lot when the letter came out. My wife asked the mechanic at the dealership about it and he said he didn't know anything about that stuff. I think the dealer's shop she goes to is a simple lube shop.

As Spike mentioned, I'm betting on a loose switch fastener for the E-brake's light actuation switch.

That's what it acts like. Only comes on when crossing a RR crossing or other rough surface. I'll investigate further.

How is the tread on the tires? Is it wearing smooth and evenly? No cupping? If the tread appears good, the bearing may be going bad. At some point, a bad bearing will cause the tire to begin to wear unevenly.

Tread depth is fine. I haven't really looked into abnormal tire wear, though. After our trip last weekend, the stuff just became too annoying to ignore any longer. I'll check actual wear on the tires when my wife gets home from work tonight.

Thanks!

 

[CJones]

On the Brake light, It sounds like the switch on the emergency brake. Disconnect one wire (and tape it). See if the problem goes away.

On the tire roar rotate the tires and if the problem stays on the rear you probably have a rear wheel bearing going out (easy and cheap to replace)

Good idea!

Thanks!

 

[CJones]

Is the buzzing related at all to the engine RPM? There's lots of things that can buzz when the resonate with the engine.

No. The buzz is definitely it's own entity. It very audibly comes-and-goes without warning. Very abrupt start and well defined noise when it (the noise) starts or stops.

The parking brake switch is in the center armrest under the parking brake handle. I have had times when something prevented the handle from getting all the way down. You can easily check on how far the handle must be raised to turn the light on and if it's really close to the down position, I think you may be able to "adjust" the switch.

Good to know where that switch is. I'll try unhooking it and see if that solves the problem or see if it needs adjusting.

Unless the car was bent in an accident, I think it's unlikely the rear suspension is significantly out of alignment and that's not likely to cause much tire noise anyway. Another possibility is a wheel bearing and this can easily be checked for when the car's on a lift (just spin the tires and listen for a noise that varies in pitch with RPM). Most likely it is the tires, I've noticed that many tires made today tend to get a lot louder as they wear. Typically, tire noise will vary with the road surface, getting louder on concrete and quieter on fresh asphalt. Have you checked the tire inflation?

Glad to hear someone say that the rear end getting out of alignment is unlikely. I was beginning to foresee large repair bills in our future if that was the case. As far as something that would cause it to be damaged - my wife hasn't said anything about something happening, and there isn't any missing paint anywhere.

I'll have the shop check the rear wheel bearings when my wife takes it for an oil change this week. I'll also check the tire wear to see if it looks uneven. Tire inflation is fine. That was my first spot to check when the noise first became noticeable.

Thanks!

 

[KennyFlys]

Hmm.. Never got a letter from anyone about a recall, but we just bought the car last June, so it's possible it was on the lot when the letter came out. My wife asked the mechanic at the dealership about it and he said he didn't know anything about that stuff. I think the dealer's shop she goes to is a simple lube shop.

To receive the recall notices, you have to provide your name and address along with the VIN to the manufacturer. I don't know about other companies but VW will keep a the last known owner's address until changed. So, it's well worthwhile providing the updates.

As far as dealers, I can't speak well for the gas engine techs but the seasoned diesel VW driver will tell you to never return to the dealer once it's out of warranty. TDI.com has a great resource and network of awesome mechanics. In fact, my last guy (before he moved back to PA) was a Delta A&P before being laid off last year.

 

[CJones]

Wellp.. One problem has been solved. When my wife got home tonight, I went out to check the rear tires and the left rear tire definitely has some issues. While all 3 other tires have normal smooth wear, the left rear has spots on the tread where the tire has warped. I'm thinking that maybe the steel belt has failed which warped the tire.

After I checked the other three tires, the tread is worn enough on the other three to justify a new full set of tires.

Let the shopping begin!

 

[gismo]

No. The buzz is definitely it's own entity. It very audibly comes-and-goes without warning. Very abrupt start and well defined noise when it (the noise) starts or stops.

I don't suppose it could be something touching the fresh air blower? Turning the fan off when it's making noise would confirm that.

 

[flyersfan31]

I come from a VW family. We had a 67 microbus that took us everywhere (including Poland and E. Germany). After 10yrs of stalwart service, traded on a 77 that crapped in 3. Had a Rabbit GTI that did well until stolen. 4 Beetles, all served admirably, except the semi-automatic transmission Super Beetle -- that was a POS. Then the used 87 Scirocco. Quality kept going downhill. My first car was a new 88 Golf. Last VW ever in my family. I had so many issues like you describe, just little crap, flashing lights, failing sensors, along with 2 failed trannies and s#1tty hardware that I swore to my wife I'd never buy another.

Lessons: 1) Don't buy a VW. Sell the one you have. Don't buy another.
2) If you think about buying a VW, follow rule #1.

 

[SCCutler]

Well, FWIW, we have a 2003 Jetta Turbo, other than its propensity to draw traffic tickets, it has been very good. Very tight, very solid.

 

[CJones]

I don't suppose it could be something touching the fresh air blower? Turning the fan off when it's making noise would confirm that.

Nope. Fan, no fan, lights on, lights off, day, night, rain, snow, sunshine, cruise on, cruise off, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th gear... Totally random. I'm almost 100% sure that it's related to the flasher relay/module. I just need to find a way to get to it. I think it's behind the dash directly behind the Flasher button. When it's buzzing and I press the flasher button in slightly, I can actually feel a little vibration in the button which immediately stops as soon as the button is pressed in to a certain point. This 'certain point' doesn't actually turn on the flashers, but it does prevent the turn signals from working.

 

[CJones]

I come from a VW family. We had a 67 microbus that took us everywhere (including Poland and E. Germany). After 10yrs of stalwart service, traded on a 77 that crapped in 3. Had a Rabbit GTI that did well until stolen. 4 Beetles, all served admirably, except the semi-automatic transmission Super Beetle -- that was a POS. Then the used 87 Scirocco. Quality kept going downhill. My first car was a new 88 Golf. Last VW ever in my family. I had so many issues like you describe, just little crap, flashing lights, failing sensors, along with 2 failed trannies and s#1tty hardware that I swore to my wife I'd never buy another.

Lessons: 1) Don't buy a VW. Sell the one you have. Don't buy another.
2) If you think about buying a VW, follow rule #1.

Well, FWIW, we have a 2003 Jetta Turbo, other than its propensity to draw traffic tickets, it has been very good. Very tight, very solid.

This is my first attempt to enter the foreign car realm. So far, I've been driving my 94 GMC Sierra since high school. We got the VW because we heard it was a (mechanically) dependable car. My wife's sister and her husband had a Passat in the mid-90's that had major electrical problems, so when I noticed the previously mentioned problems start creeping in, I started getting worried. I can put up with a random beep every once in a while to have 28mpg w/ a 5-speed with really good pick-up.

 

[rmciottijr]

The brake light could also be telling you the you are low on brake fluid. They have a float in the reservoir and I could see hitting a bump would set it off. And yea they use the same light.

Bob

 

[KennyFlys]

Well.. One problem has been solved. When my wife got home tonight, I went out to check the rear tires and the left rear tire definitely has some issues. While all 3 other tires have normal smooth wear, the left rear has spots on the tread where the tire has warped. I'm thinking that maybe the steel belt has failed which warped the tire.

After I checked the other three tires, the tread is worn enough on the other three to justify a new full set of tires.

There are a few things that could be at play to cause the noise.

One could be the tire is defective but that's very unlikely given it went for most of its life with no issue.

The second could be the balance weights came off. I'm guessing you have aluminum rims. The weights would be stuck on the inside of the rim behind a "spoke." They could be two sets located as necessary to provide the balance. The older style steel rims would have weights on the edges. Being out of balance usually causes cupping and it could vary between the inside and outside edges.

Last, the bearing could possibly be going bad which would affect the tire wear. If the bearing isn't rolling evenly, the effect could be the same as an out-of-balance tire.

I'd replace the tires but watch them closely. If you hear the noise or see the slightest uneven wear on tread, have the bearings checked. I do all my own work but off the top, I'd guess about $150-200 for labor and parts for both rear hubs.

While you're at it, it's probably worth having the rear brake pads replaced. Rear pads last a while but they are cheap enough and as long as they are in there, it should be no additional labor. As a side note, rear pads last through about three sets of front pads.

 

[gismo]

Nope. Fan, no fan, lights on, lights off, day, night, rain, snow, sunshine, cruise on, cruise off, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th gear... Totally random. I'm almost 100% sure that it's related to the flasher relay/module. I just need to find a way to get to it. I think it's behind the dash directly behind the Flasher button. When it's buzzing and I press the flasher button in slightly, I can actually feel a little vibration in the button which immediately stops as soon as the button is pressed in to a certain point. This 'certain point' doesn't actually turn on the flashers, but it does prevent the turn signals from working.

IIRC, the flasher is literally "behind the emergency flasher button" i.e. just pull the button out and the flasher comes with it.

 

[CJones]

There are a few things that could be at play to cause the noise.

One could be the tire is defective but that's very unlikely given it went for most of its life with no issue.

The second could be the balance weights came off. I'm guessing you have aluminum rims. The weights would be stuck on the inside of the rim behind a "spoke." They could be two sets located as necessary to provide the balance. The older style steel rims would have weights on the edges. Being out of balance usually causes cupping and it could vary between the inside and outside edges.

Last, the bearing could possibly be going bad which would affect the tire wear. If the bearing isn't rolling evenly, the effect could be the same as an out-of-balance tire.

I'd replace the tires but watch them closely. If you hear the noise or see the slightest uneven wear on tread, have the bearings checked. I do all my own work but off the top, I'd guess about $150-200 for labor and parts for both rear hubs.

While you're at it, it's probably worth having the rear brake pads replaced. Rear pads last a while but they are cheap enough and as long as they are in there, it should be no additional labor. As a side note, rear pads last through about three sets of front pads.

I do my own work as well - replaced front brakes, rotors, bearings on my truck last fall. I don't mind doing the work as long as I have a reasonable idea as to what the problem is. I'll have them check bearings when they replace tires.

 

[CJones]

IIRC, the flasher is literally "behind the emergency flasher button" i.e. just pull the button out and the flasher comes with it.

That's what I like to hear!

 

[tonycondon]

Well, FWIW, we have a 2003 Jetta Turbo, other than its propensity to draw traffic tickets, it has been very good. Very tight, very solid.

the turbos are excellent tow vehicles spike. When you get a glider you will have the perfect retrieve setup.

 

[SCCutler]

the turbos are excellent tow vehicles spike. When you get a glider you will have the perfect retrieve setup.

LOL!

 

[tonycondon]

they are! used almost exclusively in europe. i guess if you dont want to use it you can just sell it to me!

 

[KennyFlys]

the turbos are excellent tow vehicles spike. When you get a glider you will have the perfect retrieve setup.

Does anyone else get the impression his mind is somewhat... in an unpowered flight mode?

 

[tonycondon]

Does anyone else get the impression his mind is somewhat... in an unpowered flight mode?

thats permanent Kenny. better get used to it.