CBP and thunderstorms..

dans2992

dans2992

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Dans2992
Say I am arriving into Nogales, AZ with a CBP appointment and I am delayed by TS, or there is one hovering over the field when I arrive. Can flight service coordinate going to a different AOE?

Should I fly in circles south of the border until I can get to the originally planned field?
 
dans2992 said:
Say I am arriving into Nogales, AZ with a CBP appointment and I am delayed by TS, or there is one hovering over the field when I arrive. Can flight service coordinate going to a different AOE?

Should I fly in circles south of the border until I can get to the originally planned field?
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Personally... I would do whatever is safe so the "pilot in command" can land his plane without crashing..... and let the chips fall where they may...:yes:;)
 
Diverting is not a problem, as long as you can justify why you did, and following the requirements of 19 cfr 122.35.

19 CFR 122.35 applies to emergency or forced landings made by aircraft when necessary for safety or the preservation of life or health, when such aircraft are coming into the U.S. from a foreign area.
 
N801BH said:
Personally... I would do whatever is safe so the "pilot in command" can land his plane without crashing..... and let the chips fall where they may...:yes:;)
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Yes, although I'd prefer not to pay a $5000 fine for the privilege! :wink2:
 
dans2992 said:
Yes, although I'd prefer not to pay a $5000 fine for the privilege! :wink2:
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No fine if you notify ATC of the diversion.... And if you are coming over the border, you are either IFR or on Flight Following..... :yes:
 
So if I activate my DVFR flight plan, does that mean I am actually on the radio with ATC as I cross the ADIZ, or do I just activate the plan and get the squak code from FSS 30 mins out, and cross the border squawking the code and monitoring 121.5?
 
If you enter at Nogales, AZ, you won't have any problem. It is about the friendliest and simplest airport of entry in the country, and my AOE of choice.

The agent basically hangs out there all day, and they don't mind if you're off the ETA. Certainly if there's a substantial delay you can call FSS to update the ETA, but under an hour shouldn't be a problem. Note that despite the super-secret surveillance technology in the news, the US ATC system and it's FSS contractors can't seem to communicate with the Customs service effectively.

As to radio communications, I do exactly what you wrote: call Prescott Radio and receive a beacon code well south of the border, and monitor the FSS frequency (122.4 down there) AND 121.5 across the border. There is no requirement to have ARTCC radar service coming into the country, and unless you're higher than you want to be for landing, they won't see you anyway.


Jon
 
My understanding is that the airport is attended by customs 7 days from 8am-4pm.

I've spoken to two people over there. One indicated that "those were the hours" the other said its a 24 hour port, but they have to send someone out if its outside of those hours.

I'm probably looking at clearing in around 5pm on Sunday. Am I better off going to TUS. Or are they OK with sending someone? The answers I get from CBP are a bit "variable"...

Dan
 
The cbp.gov web site is extraordinarily difficult to use and no longer has the complete easy to read list of hours and phone numbers of all airports of entry. Nor can I find the list AOPA used to have.

That said, CBP does list Nogales as in International Airport with availability of service 24 hours a day, seven days a week. That doesn't mean someone will be there all day, but if you give required notice, they will. http://www.cbp.gov/xp/cgov/toolbox/contacts/ports/az/2604.xml
Call the number listed (520) 287-1433 to arrange arrival outside of staffed hours. This is not a big deal. In fact most AOE's don't have someone there at all unless you make advance arrangements. The designation of International Airport means you only have to give notice of arrival, not request permission. It is the responsibility of the Customs Service to staff their facilities as advertised. 5 pm is not an unreasonable time.

Jon
 
Thanks. I have called that number about 5 times and each time, it's a "ring, no answer, no voicemail, nothing". Had much better luck calling the main Nogales CBP number and pressing "0".

It would be great if they accepted (and confirmed) arrival notices via email, but I assume that is way to much to ask..... :)

Dan
 
I don't think the hassle is worth 5 grand. CBP is already in the business of "harassment-for-training-value" and self-justification of its existence and labor expenditures. So I'd say they're more in the business of pinching you than helping you clear customs and be on your way. I'd drive.

Add to that the moratorium of the 4th Amendment within 200 statute miles of the Mexican border and brother, you must be itching to write that check. I rather burn avgas and maintenance with it. Good luck, but caveat emptor.
 
Hey, it's a challenge. I love challenges! :)
 
So, I talked to FSS as I filed my DVFR flight plan. They told me that southbound it's just considered a VFR flight plan, not DVFR and that you can cross the border southbound talking to nobody and squaking 1200. They "recommended" talking to center, however.

The first briefer told me that I should open my VFR flight plan southbound with ABQ center. That didn't sound right, so I called back and talked to another briefer who told me to open it with PRC radio, which is what I expected.

What did surprise me is that they don't want me on a discrete code going southbound. What's the point of the southbound flight plan then?

I'm starting to think it would be pretty easy to leave the country southbound with no flight plan if you were a criminal.

Dan
 
One other thing... They said along with the southbound flight plan they would advise Mexican customs. I thought no notice was required to Mexican customs and that you just "showed up" at an AOE to be processed? Maybe that was the wrong impression.

They also asked me to call when I got to Mexico to close the flight plan in case Mexico did not advise them I arrived safely. I was under the impression that these border crossing flight plans basically just "went away" when you crossed the border southbound, but apparently that's not the case.
 
A lot of different issues.

The information is correct that outbound from the US a standard VFR flight plan is used. A DVFR flight plan applies to the ADIZ crossing toward the US.

A VFR flight plan is a request for search and rescue services. It is required for a border crossing, but do not expect Mexican authorities to act on it. When you fly in Mexico VFR, sometimes you will "file" your VFR flight plan AFTER you land at your destination, and it really only applies at towered airports. If you would like search and rescue service in Mexico, I suggest you tell someone you trust your itinerary, and have them report you overdue or lost if you do not check in. A personal beacon and devices like SPOT are useful in finding you if you are lost. I do generally give a position report to a US facility crossing the border if I am not on radar.

It is a misconception that you need radar service to cross the border in any direction. Outbound from the US you need a transponder with the 1200 code, which is the "ATC assigned" code for uncontrolled VFR flight, and that is what you are. Inbound across an ADIZ, you will be given a discrete code, which you can obtain from FSS or a radar facility. If not crossing an ADIZ (such as from Canada) 1200 is sufficient.

You do not need to call US FSS from Mexico to close a VFR flight plan. I don't know of anyone who's ever done that. You will go to the Mexican flight plan desk on arrival to do that.

The eAPIS program encompasses the "exit visa" you seem to find lacking. The FAA flight plan has little to do with security. There are three separate systems in place for border crossings: flight plans, eAPIS and Customs notifications. You would think doing ti once would suffice, but it doesn't. We give the information three times.

Why do you think the US government should be tracking private aircraft heading toward the border? Do we do that with cars?

It seems like a lot of effort and confusion to make a border crossing, but it really isn't that difficult. Have you made use of resources from AOPA or Baja Bush PIlots for this?

Jon
 
Well, in regards to tracking outbound flights, I've watched "border wars" on TV and see them confiscating bundles of cash from cars they search _exiting_ the US. Makes me wonder why these people don't just fly the cash. Much cheaper than having $500k confiscated. :)

Not trying to make a bigger deal of this trip than necessary, but it's my first cross border trip.

Seems like I get a lot of conflicting messages. For example, FSS tells me that "I don't have to contact US customs inbound, they'll do that for me". However that goes against other advice I've seen on this forum to always call customs and inform them of your arrival time.

I'll just call and notify everyone and play it safe.. :)
 
I did use the AOPA checklist. I was a member of Baja Bush Pilots a few years ago, however I let my membership lapse and didn't think it was really worth $50 for the limited amount of info.

Plus, BBP sold "Mexican" insurance for years, when it was not really necessary as long as your existing policy covered Mexico. I think that left a bad impression on a lot of pilots...
 
dans2992 said:
Plus, BBP sold "Mexican" insurance for years, when it was not really necessary as long as your existing policy covered Mexico. I think that left a bad impression on a lot of pilots...
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An insurance policy from a Mexican insurance company may not be technically required, but it sure does make things easier. When I went to Cancun, I was asked for my proof of insurance and they were clearly expecting a policy from a Mexican company. Having a policy from a Mexican company that is in Spanish and English sure is nice when you are in a foreign country and playing by their rules. I didn't want to be in the position of trying to explain my American insurance policy covered Mexico. You can buy coverage for Mexico by the day and I don't remember it being very expensive.

Ryan



Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD
 
I arrived in Cabo today (direct from KFFZ). Customs and documentation took all of about 5 minutes. I paid the "handling fee" to the FBO, but it was worth it to expedite the process with 5 pax including a 3 year old... :)

Basically, sign here, here, and here. Ok, done.
 
dans2992 said:
I arrived in Cabo today (direct from KFFZ). Customs and documentation took all of about 5 minutes. I paid the "handling fee" to the FBO, but it was worth it to expedite the process with 5 pax including a 3 year old... :)

Basically, sign here, here, and here. Ok, done.
Click to expand...

Hope coming back is as painless...:dunno::confused:
 
I'm sure CBP will break out the latex gloves. :)

Nogales sounds like a good port to clear in though...

Dan
 
Clearing through Nogales was a total non-event. Had to show passports. That's it. Nothing else requested. Took 5 mins.

Dan
 
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