I bought an airplane. It was a lifelong dream. 6 months later, I'm out. (Reddit post)

fasteddie

Pre-takeoff checklist
Joined
Mar 27, 2017
Messages
183
Display Name

Display name:
Fasteddie
This was posted on Reddit recently. I thought it was an interesting perspective, and figured this board would appreciate it. Link here, text copied in below:

I bought an airplane. It was a lifelong dream. 6 months later, I'm out. Not because it's expensive to own. I knew it would be. It's not because insurance is high and hard to find. I knew that going in. And it's not because the price of fuel doubled a month after I bought it. I can afford it. And not because "GA is dying" either. After my experience, I don't believe GA is dying,….

…it's long dead and we've just been looting the corpse. Here's my story.

It's been in my blood since childhood. I've been a pilot for 20 years, but always a renter/clubber. My flying activity level waxed and waned over the years, but recent growth in income along with "settling down" in an area with a good club and aviation community enabled me to fly a lot more. I stretched my wings to bigger, faster planes, got my instrument rating, got my wife involved, flew some Pilot's n Paws, etc. It was a great time, but schedule availability and unreliable planes kept me looking for more.

I researched the hell out of aircraft ownership. For years. I explored build vs. buy, new vs. used, talked to tons of owners, did cost calculation spreadsheets, and so on. I got the right memberships to access the right data, forums, etc. We talked it over many times, and made careful decisions. I went in eyes wide open, or so I thought.

The perfect plane popped up for sale. As luck would have it, it was at my home airport. Fit the mission perfectly, had new paint, upgraded panel, great interior, fair price, all the right stuff. I made an offer, went under contract, and got ready to call around for a pre-buy.

The first shop said "we're not accepting new bookings, we're too busy". What? I could understand, "It'll be a few weeks", even "It'll be a lot of weeks", but "no?". And this was a shop that advertised specializing in this specific make/model! Just "no?" Well, maybe it's a fluke. Let's call the next shop.

"No."

And, this was the shop that normally maintained the plane! "Are you sure?"

"Okay, fine. We'll do it, but it'll be $4,500 and 6 weeks out."

That seemed egregious. So I kept calling. I found a shop who would drive 70 miles and do the prebuy for a fair price, 4 weeks from now. I booked it. The seller was ****ed. I offered to work with anyone he could find who was quicker. He couldn't find anyone.

6 weeks later and after a week or so of pestering the shop to send over the results of the pre-buy, I re-negotiated the deal based on the findings and closed on my dream plane. But wait.

By now, the plane was out of annual. The owner didn't want to wait another 6 weeks to close the deal, so he knocked $5k off the price and sold without. The shop who did the pre-buy agreed to knock $1,500 off the annual if I did it with them. Sweet. In 6 weeks. And it would require a ferry permit. Okay, fine. It's worth waiting for. I'll skip the details here, but the FAA went in circles with us for a few weeks, required some field trips for the mechanic to inspect/address certain items, then issued the permit.

Weeks go by. Silence. I call the shop and leave a message. Nothing. Online ADSB trackers show my plane taking a quick flight around the patch. Is that normal during an annual? Who knows. We'll assume it is. Call after a week. Leave another message. "We're getting to it, we got backed up. Next week for sure." Weeks go by. Silence. Okay, one bad apple. Clear skies from here.

Finally, one glorious day they call and tell me to come pick it up. My wife drives me 90 minutes to the nearby airport. I taxi out to the runup. As soon as I add RPM, a screeching noise fills the headset/intercom. It didn't do that before. I can't hear the tower. I taxi back to the shop. He pulls the radios and blows on the connectors. Fiddles with the headset jacks. We fire it back up. Sounds okay now. I depart.

At 500 AGL, the screech returns. I know I won't be able to hear or accept a landing clearance, so I manage to exchange "frequency change approved" with the tower as I exit the Class D and continue to my home airport, which is uncontrolled and sleepy this time of day.

Are you still with me? It gets much worse. I can't fly it back in this condition, so I call the shop on the home field and describe the issue. "I can look at it next week. I'll let you know." Weeks go by. I call back. "I'll look at it this week." Weeks go by. "I'll look at it tonight." Finally.

He calls the next day to tell me I need a $2k alternator. Okay, aviation's expensive, no biggie. I stop by the field that night to fiddle around, just to be sure. In 30 seconds I isolate the issue to a rear passenger headset jack. If I plug a headset into that jack, the sound goes away. Doesn't seem like an alternator to me. Tell the mechanic. He finds that the previous mechanic (who did the annual) incorrectly re-installed the interior trim and the jack was grounding to the frame. Easy fix. I spent 30 seconds of my own barely-know-what-I'm-doing time to do what he couldn't in a month. Shouldn't he have checked something that obvious before ordering me a new alternator? Did he even look at the plane? It was still at its tiedown when I went to the field. So, probably not. Maybe he just quoted me something expensive to get me off the phone. Okay, two bad apples. Clear skies from here.

So now after 3 months, I can finally fly it, right? I take a few VFR trips. Awesome. Oops, low marine layer today, I'll need an IFR departure. I get cleared via ODP, which requires a radial intercept. At the hold short line, I configure the GTN. There's no OBS mode. It doesn't work. Brand new $100k full glass Garmin flight deck and I literally cannot adjust the CRS. There is no function/knob to do it. WTF? Where is VLOC mode? What? Cancel clearance and park it.

Read the manuals, ask on the forums, fuss around some more. It's installed incorrectly. The shop that put in the $100k panel not only configured it incorrectly, they didn't do the basic return to service tests specified by Garmin. I know they didn't because they would've failed it immediately. I didn't notice when I inspected the plane before buying. I didn't think to check OBS mode or notice that the CDI won't switch to VLOC mode. It's not legal to fly IFR, and probably not airworthy at all. Okay, lets call some Garmin certified shops and get this squared away. Voicemail. No response. Voicemail. "I don't work on those anymore". Voicemail. No response. "Call me back tomorrow, I'm busy."

Finally get a Garmin expert from another shop on the phone. Tell him I'll fly it to him and leave it as long as necessary. "You're probably doing something wrong. You're not supposed to change OBS or VLOC modes on the GTN." I explain that the PFD manual specifically says the opposite and what he's describing doesn't work on my panel. "Call Garmin support."

So, here I sit, 6 months later. Still can't fly it, still waiting for support. With no end in sight of the cycle of trying to find someone to fix it, and then waiting for it to be fixed. Every mechanic that's touched it seems to be unable to do work of any level of quality, despite every one of them being a certified expert in this make. And those were the ones who would answer the phone!

And I can't sell it, because I don't have an updated title or registration from the FAA yet. 6 months later.

In my industry, or any other industry I'm connected to or ever worked with/in, any business that functioned this way would be out of business in a year, max. There's only one reason this ****show is accepted. It's because they're the only ones left. The customer has no choice. This industry isn't dying, it's long dead. Those still in it are just turning out the lights on their way out the door, carrying any last thing of value they could find.

I guess I'll follow them out the door before it gets too dark in here. I'm hanging up my wings. I'll find a new dream. I'm out.
 
Yowzers. That was quite the saga he ran into and not so great first time owner experience. I hope he gets things sorted and can enjoy the plane.

is it really that hard to find mechanics in some parts of the country? Mine is a 30 minute flight away (by choice, it’s just a good shop). We had a retired guy who helped out with some stuff on the field but he sadly passed away.
 
Everyone is incompetent and doesn't want to work on it is the gist I got. Shops are busy and a good mechanic is hard to find....but it's not everyone. And if it is feeling like everyone, it's probably you.
 
Wish we knew what part of the country. Might be able to find better assistance.
 
Author lives in SoCal. He said South LA but several posts refer to places and businesses in San Diego.
 
Last edited:
The story is not hard to believe. You entered the market at the wrong time. Maybe you live in a region where the problem is particularly acute. Many older and experienced people have left the profession or have died of covid. Most people who entered the workforce in the last 5 years don't like to do anything with their hands. They'd rather work from home over zoom. When you combine all of that with supply chain issues, things can go south pretty quickly.
 
On my sleepy, uncontrolled, in the middle of nowhere, SK, Canada airfield there are THREE mechanics and an avionics shop. I've only worked with one of the three mechanics and scheduling hasn't been an issue, even last minute "hey can you look at the gear and fix it by this weekend for my trip" type of requests. 20 minutes east is a larger airport with three mechanics and one avionics shop. Worked with one mechanic and the avionics shop. Scheduling never been an issue. An hour south is my main mechanic who does my annuals and recently full interior rebuild. Scheduling never been an issue. An hour north is another airport with three mechanics and an avionics shop, they are always "busy" but that's because they rather play around with jets and turbo props, no time for a little Cherokee I guess. That's fine, they're not getting my $$$ then.

On trips away from home, I had maintenance issues in Manitoba. Local shop was busy but managed to squeeze me in for repair with no issues. Had maintenance issues in North Dakota. Local shop had no problem getting me back in the air within three days. They would have done it same day but we had to wait for a part. Had maintenance issues in Arkansas and the local mechanic, although according to him also super busy (and his hangar was full of planes), he got me back up in the air within two days.

Sometimes it's about the attitude on how you approach things. Where there is a will, there is a way. Maybe flying isn't that much of a priority to the poster of this story after all.
 
Maintenance is a huge concern for me now. I'm waiting to see if the FAA has any announcements regarding MOSAIC next week...
 
Most important decision in airplane ownership is finding the right mechanic who you respect and he respects you. There are very few left. I might not trust many people I deal with, but I have to trust my mechanic or find one I do trust or sell the plane.
 
This is pretty much just life in SoCal, tbh. Wait’ll the FAA gets up your ass about something then you’ll really love aviation.
 
Anyone ever try that “Savvy aviation management” service? Seems like they might be able to assist on things like this.

Sadly, on the incompetence side, I’ve seen a lot of mistakes from “certified” A&Ps…. Don’t think the certifications are worth much, TBH.

fuel senders connected to wrong tanks, totally improper install of ADSB transponder, completely mis-wired intercom, 200lb error on W&B emtpy weight…. Not small stuff.
 
A good article but the author is mistaken.

He is better suited for renting where he's abstracted from these hassles.... I feel his frustration on the communication side, but part of it is just an unrealistic expectation of mechs being available on demand. Frankly, his conclusion should have been: "BIG OPPORTUNITY IN MY AREA FOR A&Ps!".

... For comparison...

When I wanted my bathroom remodeled I had to call about a dozen GCs to find one I liked with a reasonable fee. A solid quarter of them wouldn't even entertain the idea. Still then when I found one -- he was booked out for 10 months. Couldn't touch the house for nearly a year!

Was remodeling dead? No!
Was home ownership dead? No!

In fact it was booming more than ever before.
 
I moved once to a new house where everyone around me had at least 5 acres of land (or more). We met all of our "neighbors" (basically everyone with a house within sight of our house) which amounted to exactly 6 households. Everyone was very nice. Everyone, with one exception, seemed to get along with everyone. The one exception was warning me, "Watch out for this guy, watch out for that guy, blah blah blah..." Can you guess which neighbor I eventually had a problem with? Much like this reddit guy, there is a common denominator....
 
Last edited:
Yeah finding a good shop is tricky. The advice seems to be treat it like a partnership.. It sucks.. Praise the lord you dont live in the UK
 
The original poster has not even had to deal with the parts problem yet. It can be difficult to get the parts you need, especially from some of the more precarious manufacturers. For one, I have had a $450 piece of rubber ordered from Mooney since October 2021, supposedly with a 15 week lead time. Will I ever get it? I just hope I can go a couple more years before needing an engine overhaul, as that is where the worst delays are now.
Jon
 
I can sympathize with the guy. The costs associated get more stupid by the day, and the regulatory capture of the industry makes cost-effective solutions impossible.

But to paraphrase Gen. Patton, 'God help me, I love it so.'
 
The parts problem is serious… on the twin Cessna forums two twins are grounded for months waiting for turbo parts. What country are we living in?
 
Too many words to read. I skimmed it. My take away is he stopped flying because the radio didn't work. I'm thinking there's a different root cause.
Perhaps you should work directly for the NTSB. After glancing at the accident scene for 1 minute you can write a scathing report and then hit the bar.
 
Good shops are hard to find. Tougher in SoCal. I know of a good avionics shop, but he's in Florida and likely booked for a while too.

Seen some questionable work on my plane after just purchasing it. IMO, the trick is to find someone that knows the plane (or does good work and will come to know the plane) and stick with that shop.
 
The original poster had an interesting perspective on aircraft ownership and, if I went through what he describes, I might have the same perspective and give it up. I am happy to report that my experience with aircraft ownership, which spans 25 years and six airplanes, has been very different. By and large, I have found the maintenance people for engines, airframe and avionics to be extremely helpful and professional. Certainly not infallible, but they are all good and try to make sure that I have an airplane that is safe and reliable.

In fact, to me what they are describing sounds more like what everyone is experiencing in the post-Covid, Gen Z economy. It is the same reason we go into restaurants and there are tons of empty tables, but no one to work them.

Right now, no matter what industry you are in, it is nearly impossible to find people that want to work. Ads for jobs go unanswered and when people to respond and find a resume that is worth following up, the first question asked is whether the job is fully remote. If the answer is no, often the person is no longer interested in the job. Those that pursue employment want to work the minimal amount in low stress jobs and get paid like senior execs.

As others have pointed out, the supply chain issues certainly don’t help, either.

However, I believe that this too shall pass, and people will start wandering back to the workforce because they have to. Hopefully, at that point, things will improve for all of us, including aviation.

Abram Finkelstein
N685AS
 
I’ve just finished an Annual plus several involved projects on my plane, based in Southern California. The very professional and hard working A&P I work with did about 10% of the work (13 hrs labor) including the inspection, supervision and logbook entires. That is the way many or most of the hundreds of planes surrounding me at my base are maintained, with owner involvement under A&P supervision, and it seems to work well. The few that go to “a shop” for hands off service versus being maintained in their own hangar are new Cirruses, rental planes and the like, owned by guys proffering credit cards and unconcerned with the charge. That’s fine and keeps those shops in business but it’s not how most owners get it done effectively. The world of older airplanes and enthusiast owners has moved on from that model by my observation, these are no longer consumer products that you take to ‘the dealer’ or equivalent, they are specialist items requiring attention and productive relationships to maintain. This guy is mistaking his lack of understanding and inability to figure it out with GA having “died”.

As an aside, my airframe parts come from a small FBO in Germany and just about everything is available as new old stock, with patience to allow for delivery times. It’s ironic that I chose a very unusual plane and can get new airframe parts from stock.

The one area I have some sympathy with this fellow is in dealing with Garmin avionics and Garmin dealers. That seems to me a racket, filled with bad business practices.
 
Last edited:
Right now, no matter what industry you are in, it is nearly impossible to find people that want to work.
... for the pay that you're offering. It's a free market so, supply of workers is low and demand is high, and if prices don't increase to accommodate then you won't be getting the supply.
 
... for the pay that you're offering. It's a free market so, supply of workers is low and demand is high, and if prices don't increase to accommodate then you won't be getting the supply.

what you say is true right now. But, once the recession really takes hold, demand for products and services will go down, and companies will lay folks off. Then worker supply will increase, and wages will stagnate, as the economy slows down and inflation reduces. Just the natural cycle of things. Give it 1-2 years.
 
what you say is true right now. But, once the recession really takes hold, demand for products and services will go down, and companies will lay folks off. Then worker supply will increase, and wages will stagnate, as the economy slows down and inflation reduces. Just the natural cycle of things. Give it 1-2 years.
completely agree
 
what you say is true right now. But, once the recession really takes hold, demand for products and services will go down, and companies will lay folks off. Then worker supply will increase, and wages will stagnate, as the economy slows down and inflation reduces. Just the natural cycle of things. Give it 1-2 years.

And to think that there are already some in the business world with some knowledge (or just opinions) of economics that are hinting we may not really end up with a recession. Regardless, there will be cycles of growth and contraction, we just don’t know exactly when or what it will look like until it happens.

I like the idea of hands-on owner involved maintenance with oversight and wish more were interested in that approach. I also think there is room for an entrepreneurial minded A&P to open their own shop in an unserviced area, have some help with admin, customer service, or other aspects of the business, and succeed. But, how many have the interest, drive, patience with local politics, and vision to dream a little bigger and make it happen? Much easier to just jump to that higher paying job somewhere else.
 
Given the market crash, it's hard not to believe we're already in a recession. :)

Actually, being an AP might be a fun retirement gig. Two years of school? OK, could be helpful in getting me out of the house (wife would like that). Where to train? Surely there are schools in the ATL area. And..... not finding it easy to search. Doesn't seem like there are many schools around that can graduate an AP.
 
BTW - part of the years of preparation should have also included finding a reliable shop / mechanic, getting ready for the purchase, investigating how much time it would take to get a pre buy, etc.
 
There is alot of truth to that post. I've been flying since I was 18;years old and have owned a few airplanes. I don't recommend this flying lifestyle unless you are very rich (I am not) or unless you are willing to completely get involved in the maintenance and upkeep of your airplane (which I am).

Look into the requirements to get an A&P license - that piece of paper in no way makes someone an "expert" in regard to working on airplanes. Just like a PPL does not make anyone an expert pilot. If anyone just throws their trust blindly behind an A&P they will regret it.

Learn your airplane and work on it yourself to the extent allowed and and work alongside your A&P for everything else.

But yes, we do put up with an awful lot of incompetence in this "hobby".
 
I stand in solidarity with the author. I've made my comments on reddit, not interested in expanding on here.

Look into the requirements to get an A&P license - that piece of paper in no way makes someone an "expert" in regard to working on airplanes.

I have, and they're too onerous for a recreational participant not otherwise employed by it. I'd love for them to release these lawnmowers to EAB mx allowances currently afforded to non-builders. Heck, even an LSRM requirement would be fine by me as a palatable gatekeeping antic, as is presently available to the unduly handicapped de facto ultralights they call SLSA.

As long as the ossified regulator continues to stonewall those allowances for the long-ago orphaned facbuilts, the sector will continue slowly marching to the scrap yard. And the apologists will continue to throw their true Scotsman fallacies for why the critics of the status quo don't belong in "their" hobby. *shrugs*
 
Get your hands dirty or write the checks?

Most likely some of each plus “research “.
 
I’m gonna say he was probably minimally involved in the GA community. Seems he was a renter, and jumped into ownership without guidance to seek good information from. Sadly I see the community is more online based instead of airport based. 25 years ago there would be plenty of airport bums sit around talk, have some drinks. These days it is jump in the p,and, go, come back, tie down, get in the car and leave. Even CFI, and students, do the lesson, head out. No hanging around the airport.
 
Back
Top