Proof! Traffic jams are required by law!

[mikea]

I always though that the powers in and around Chicago had maps where they figured out ways that drivers might get around construction closures so they can block those, too.

New Virginia Toll Lanes Designed to Create Congestion
Illegal political donations helped give Australian company full control over Virginia transportation until the year 2087.

...

In June, the US Department of Transportation created a first-of-its-kind $1.6 billion financing package that consisted of tax-free bonds, loans and state taxpayer grants to support the project that will add a pair of High Occupancy Toll (HOT) lanes to the Interstate 495 Capital Beltway just outside of Washington, DC. To this amount, Transurban only added $349 million of its own capital -- less than the cost of interest -- toward the construction of the toll lanes (details).

In return for that small investment, Transurban received from Virginia officials the right to demand payment from state taxpayers any time that improvements are made to a number of free roads near the Beltway. In effect, the contract between the Virginia Department of Transportation (VDOT) and Transurban is designed to ensure the area remains sufficiently congested so that motorists will have an incentive to pay to use the toll lanes.


http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/24/2458.asp

You knew it couldn't be mere incompetence, right?

 

[wsuffa]

Texas has the same deal - except even better for the private companies... that deal says the companies have a veto power over improvements on roads that parallel the toll road.

 

[rubber314chicken]

that is the point where you need to walk into the senate, and shove the Deceleration of Independence in every one of their faces until they realize they are in violation of the document that got us where we are. That is in just, and I think there might be a law somewhere about being forced to buy a product. Kinda like killing everyone that doesn't buy your product.

 

[Brian Austin]

that is the point where you need to walk into the senate, and shove the Deceleration of Independence in every one of their faces until they realize they are in violation of the document that got us where we are. That is in just, and I think there might be a law somewhere about being forced to buy a product. Kinda like killing everyone that doesn't buy your product.

Ah, but there's the rub. You're not FORCED to travel those toll roads. You're merely ENCOURAGED to travel them.

The legal beagles would be the only winners in that case, I'm afraid.

 

[ScottM]

The thing that annoys me around Chicago is Lake County (Where Mike lives). Why can they not have a 4 lane road heading east or west through their county? If I have to drive tot he east it is one giant back up all the time.

 

[EdFred]

If you don't live in the city packed in like mindless rats you don't have this problem.
I just looked out on the "major" 4 lane divided coming into the south side of Grand Rapids, and during the morning "rushour" over the past minute I counted only 25 cars total. I have no sympathy for anyone who lives around millions of other rats and then complains that, gasp, there's millions of other rats around them.

Can you tell I despise the city?

 

[wsuffa]

Ah, but there's the rub. You're not FORCED to travel those toll roads. You're merely ENCOURAGED to travel them.

The legal beagles would be the only winners in that case, I'm afraid.

Correct.

The plan for toll roads in San Antonio will turn existing highway lanes into "service roads" with traffic lights. That's because Texas law requires the same number of free lanes to be available if a road gets new toll lanes. The law does not, however, mandate that they be the same quality of lane as before - meaning they can be converted to a service road.

These kinds of exclusivity agreements are pretty common. They would be less objectionable if it weren't for the fact that the government is fronting a lot of the capital in order that the private entity gets the tolls..... IMHO, it's a lot like stadium projects that are government funded but financially benefit a single commercial entity.

 

[ScottM]

If you don't live in the city packed in like mindless rats you don't have this problem.
I just looked out on the "major" 4 lane divided coming into the south side of Grand Rapids, and during the morning "rushour" over the past minute I counted only 25 cars total. I have no sympathy for anyone who lives around millions of other rats and then complains that, gasp, there's millions of other rats around them.

Can you tell I despise the city?

I am 35 miles outside of the city (that is to the edge of Chicago) and it is still crappy traffic. I live right on the edge of the suburbs. Far too often builders put up all kinds of housing developments and hope the counties and state will update the roads sometime in the future.

 

[mikea]

The thing that annoys me around Chicago is Lake County (Where Mike lives). Why can they not have a 4 lane road heading east or west through their county? If I have to drive tot he east it is one giant back up all the time.

Because if they make it 4 lanes my house won't be there to drive to and a good part of the town will be gone. The bypass plan is what they need to get going. Most of the required land is already set aside or government owned.

Now that I have cable, I have the pleasure of being to watch village and county board meetings. Lake County Chairman "Susie" said that for the county transportation is priority #1 but for the last 19 years Lake County hasn't gotten any highway funding. It must have been one of those Home Rule deals that applies to any city named Chicago and any county named Cook. The result is that Lake County doesn't have a gas tax, while as we know, Cook County has the highest taxes in the entire country and Chicago just became #1 with sales taxes at 11.25%.

I think like with AvGas a fuel tax is a pretty fair way to pay for roads and public transportation. You know, maybe we can get some money from outsiders who use the roads.

It's also pretty aggravating seeing how they have to apply, beg and cajole with the state and the feds to get "matching funds" to repair and improve what are mostly state and federal roads. They have to jump through hoops to get the money back that the peoplel here gave them in the first place. And of course sending the money through the hands of those mopes is really efficient.

The point is we don't know what's quietly put into these laws, like how maybe the airlines are lobbying for lower speed limits. Things like that cost citizens $billions in time=money, besides stealing from their productivity and lifespan.

 

[EdFred]

I am 35 miles outside of the city (that is to the edge of Chicago) and it is still crappy traffic. I live right on the edge of the suburbs. Far too often builders put up all kinds of housing developments and hope the counties and state will update the roads sometime in the future.

You might not be in Chicago proper, but that giant cesspool and its traffic mess sprawls all the way out to Elgin and Aurora. It should never take 2 hours to go 5 miles. Ever!

 

[mikea]

You might not be in Chicago proper, but that giant cesspool and its traffic mess sprawls all the way out to Elgin and Aurora. It should never take 2 hours to go 5 miles. Ever!

Scott is more than 35 miles away...maybe as the crow flies...I have 50 miles of driving into the north side of the city and he's further west.

Chicago just came in #3 for the worst traffic in the US. Even beat out Atlanta.

That's what you get when you have a dysfunctional state legislature and a city which more interested in giving out contracts to connected companies than planning ahead. The CTA has deteriorated to the point where the exceptional is no exception. Most passengers think it's a rare miracle when they don't have delays....but hey! CHICAGO WILL WELCOME THE OLYMPICS and the resulting foreign relations disaster that will follow.

 

[ScottM]

You might not be in Chicago proper, but that giant cesspool and its traffic mess sprawls all the way out to Elgin and Aurora. It should never take 2 hours to go 5 miles. Ever!

I live west of those places. Well NW actually

But I agree with about the giant sweltering cesspool of traffic we have.

When I was working in Milwaukee I laughed when they would tell me the traffic was terrible. When it was at it's worst it took me 40 minutes to get downtown from New Berlin. If that was Chicago it would have been an 1hr and 40 minutes for the same distance.

 

[ScottM]

Scott is more than 35 miles away...maybe as the crow flies...I have 50 miles of driving into the north side of the city and he's further west.

Chicago just came in #3 for the worst traffic in the US. Even beat out Atlanta.

That's what you get when you have a dysfunctional state legislature and a city which more interested in giving out contracts to connected companies than planning ahead. The CTA has deteriorated to the point where the exceptional is no exception. Most passengers think it's a rare miracle when they don't have delays....but hey! CHICAGO WILL WELCOME THE OLYMPICS and the resulting foreign relations disaster that will follow.

I am 35 miles from ORD. Which is Chicago technically. But to get into the real part of the city it is more like 50.

Schaumburg traffic is so bad I am starting to avoid driving there as well.

 

[mikea]

I am 35 miles from ORD. Which is Chicago technically. But to get into the real part of the city it is more like 50.

Schaumburg traffic is so bad I am starting to avoid driving there as well.

In Schaumburg it can take 30 minutes to just get through the 3 miles and 15 lights on Golf by Woodfield, not that they need computer control on synchonization or anything. We are supposed to get the intelligence with even human control on major roads in Lake County (It's been "coming soon" for the more-than-a-year I've been here.)

 

[nddons]

I live west of those places. Well NW actually

But I agree with about the giant sweltering cesspool of traffic we have.

When I was working in Milwaukee I laughed when they would tell me the traffic was terrible. When it was at it's worst it took me 40 minutes to get downtown from New Berlin. If that was Chicago it would have been an 1hr and 40 minutes for the same distance.

Come on back up, Scott, the water's fine! Well at least the Miller is.

That is exactly why I'm in Milwaukee. I used to live in Mundelein, and either took the Metra train from Libertyville (not too bad, only a 1:40 min commute each way door to door) or drove downtown or to clients, which usually meant you had to allow 2 hours to be safe.

So, the Tri-State (I-294) tollway is torn up, the Edens Expy (I-94) is torn up, and just this weekend I found out that I-90/I-39 around Rockford is torn up. Do you folks in Illinois reeeaaaallllly not want anyone from Wisconsin to visit your state?

 

[ScottM]

Come on back up, Scott, the water's fine! Well at least the Miller is.

And Miller is water.

Do you folks in Illinois reeeaaaallllly not want anyone from Wisconsin to visit your state?

seems that way. Now if we could only keep the Michiganers out of here

 

[mikea]

...
So, the Tri-State (I-294) tollway is torn up, the Edens Expy (I-94) is torn up, and just this weekend I found out that I-90/I-39 around Rockford is torn up. Do you folks in Illinois reeeaaaallllly not want anyone from Wisconsin to visit your state?

I tol' ya! They gots a map! They plan very carefully to make sure there's no way for anyone, native or not, to get in or out unimpeded.

The tollway and the Edens work will be done by the end of September. As aways, they'll dig up the tollway again starting next March.

The Edens works better. I spent 30 minutes on teh tollway/Edens spur the weekened before last. They "fixed" the dangerous lane reduction by moving it 1500 feet west. I guess that was so the crashes are 1500 feet further away from north shore homes.

 

[2256Q]

The legal beagles would be the only winners in that case, I'm afraid.

Not to be a total cynic - well, yes, I am - but isn't that always the case?

 

[flyingcheesehead]

Chicago just came in #3 for the worst traffic in the US. Even beat out Atlanta.

They say LA and NY are worse, but I've never had the problems in LA and NY that I have in Chitcago. Maybe I just don't go there (LA/NY) enough.

CHICAGO WILL WELCOME THE OLYMPICS and the resulting foreign relations disaster that will follow.

So, when do they make up their mind whether Chicago gets it or not? Who else is still in the running? Cuz ya know, if Chicago does get the olympics, there goes the last hope of CGX ever coming back.