Fast Eddie & Kool Karen's (excellent?) Pole Barn Adventure

That’s gonna be bitchin!
 
One thing to put out there...

The original plan was based on the hangar being roughly at runway level.

But every foot above the runway we can manage is one less foot of retaining wall, with associated savings there.

So, the thought is, how much of a grade is feasible before it becomes problematical? The pole barn has to be set back 40’ from the runway edge, and I assume I’ll want a level portion right in front of the pole barn to push things out onto. So I guess I’m asking how many feet of rise can I have over a 20’ run before the steepness becomes an issue? Meeting with the contractor today or tomorrow to discuss.

Thanks!
 
A while back I was curious due to looking at airparks, some on rather interesting gradients.
Going on memory, FAA has 1.5% slope change over 100ft of lateral distance. The max slop for runways was something like 3% but taxiways could be as much as 6%.
The real issue was the curve at the bottom of the grade, the problem is prop clearance as the pavement curves upwards.
If you plane on a straight in taxi with the nose of the plane to the back wall, you can actually continue the grade into the hangar, and then you get a gravity assist on pulling the plane out. One airpark, in NC if I recall correctly, had a gentle slope into the hangar for the "model" home. The owner would make sure the wheel is straight, release the brakes and let the plane roll out. He used power to pull the plane in.

Tim
 
N659HB said:
Don't think Eddie has to worry about prop strike.
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Only if he's inverted while taxiing.

BUT, he might get a different plane someday, or want to sell the property to someone else with a different plane.
 
FastEddieB said:
One thing to put out there...

The original plan was based on the hangar being roughly at runway level.

But every foot above the runway we can manage is one less foot of retaining wall, with associated savings there.

So, the thought is, how much of a grade is feasible before it becomes problematical? The pole barn has to be set back 40’ from the runway edge, and I assume I’ll want a level portion right in front of the pole barn to push things out onto. So I guess I’m asking how many feet of rise can I have over a 20’ run before the steepness becomes an issue? Meeting with the contractor today or tomorrow to discuss.

Thanks!
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I got into this problem with drainage from a home. The slab for the home and the street were at the same elevation for all practical purposes. Ended up sloping the yard and driveway to the bottom of the ditch. Not real pretty but it salvaged the project.

In other words, for drainage alone I suspect you’ll want a couple feet of elevation change from the pole barn floor to the runway. Draining the cut into the hillside should also be a priority. Avoid building a mud puddle for a homesite.

These things sound a little obvious but I’ve seen it messed up often enough, particularly making sure the cuts are drained.
 
Half Fast said:
Only if he's inverted while taxiing.

BUT, he might get a different plane someday, or want to sell the property to someone else with a different plane.
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Yeah, there's that to consider. He may get another Cirrus, or even better, a Moonanza.
 
Excavation begins!

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Half Fast said:
Excellent! What's the construction in the background? Is that yours, too?
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Nope.

Airport owner providing space for other eventual tenants.

Right now just one hardworking guy running both the backhoe and bobcat. Says helpers are hard to find. He’s done good work for us before and we trust him.
 
FastEddieB said:
Nope.

Airport owner providing space for other eventual tenants.

Right now just one hardworking guy running both the backhoe and bobcat. Says helpers are hard to find. He’s done good work for us before and we trust him.
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Well sure they are hard to find. Would that helpers pay come out of your guys pay?
 
I agree with those who recommend one floor. The fewer stairs the better. Having the house on the hill above the hangar is a good idea but do have plumbing in the hangar. If you have a good builder the top of the hangar can be your sundeck/observation deck.
 
ITS NOT A HANGAR!!!

But it IS a pole barn with a bathroom, so plumbing and septic has already been permitted.

We do envision a deck cantilevered out over the pole barn from the house. But first things first.
 
Stopped by briefly yesterday:

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Clearly progress has been made, but it looks like rain and ground water may be an issue.

Speaking to the contractor shortly...

Says the water will have to be pumped out, but they’re possibly getting equipment out this afternoon in preparation for pouring the footers.
 
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Looks like you have a very good plan,good luck and enjoy.
 
Just a suggestion: require the contractor to grade the site to drain before pouring the footers. Otherwise there will be problems every time it rains during the construction and potentially for the life of the pole barn.
 
Clark1961 said:
Just a suggestion: require the contractor to grade the site to drain before pouring the footers. Otherwise there will be problems every time it rains during the construction and potentially for the life of the pole barn.
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I was going to suggest the same.
 
Or install some french drains around where the footers will go.
 
Thanks for all the advice.

As you guys know from my threads on wiring our RV pedestal and the more recent one that resulted in our concrete slab, I do take advice and recommendations to heart and appreciate them. Keep them coming!

In this case, I sort of have to trust my contractor and his ability to choose competent subcontractors. We are constantly communicating to make sure we’re on the same page. But I want to be careful about “micromanaging” every little detail. Most times when I express a concern, it’s recognized as well founded but has invariably already been taken into consideration.

That said, it’s been over a week since we’ve been to the property. In that week, apparently they’ve dug out for the footers and at least begun to lay the metal reinforcement and tie-ins for the walls. Dale, our contractor, sent us these photos:

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In any case, headed up there tomorrow or Tuesday - the weather’s been clear and dry up there - and here - albeit unbearably cold. So, more photos and progress reports to follow.
 
A barn without Owls is just a barn. Who gives a hoot? :D Don't lie awake at night hoping they will see you are sleeping and want to disturb you. They have infinite patience.

When I was young owls loved to hoot as I was walking home in the dark and scaring the **** out of me.

Nuff said.
 
FastEddieB said:
Quick trip up yesterday to check on the progress:

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The extreme cold has slowed things down a bit, but we're expecting some warmer weather. If all goes well they'll finish the forms and be ready to pour the walls this week.
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Finally a proper piece of equipment in those pics (CAT mini excavator). :D
 
FastEddieB said:
Quick trip up yesterday to check on the progress:

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Dude!!

Maybe you missed this bit of advice from your "tie down spot" thread:

timwinters said:
Nice job, dude!!

Just one more suggestion if I may...don't gag your lolly in getting it back filled. The worse thing that can happen now is to have rain runoff undercut it by washing some of the gravel out from under it.

Re-establishing proper sub grade compaction if this happens is damned near impossible.
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Doesn't look like it's back filled yet...and you had all that equipment and dirt available when they were digging out the pad for your pole barn???? That's a shame if it indeed isn't back filled.

If you lose compaction around the perimeter of this slab then you're screwed and the edges will most likely break away.
 
I’ll prioritize the backfilling next time up.

If I had known things would proceed this quickly, I might have waited.

Good learning experience regardless.
 
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We were last briefly up last Sunday to check out progress. We were surprised to find a crew working in spite of it being Sunday and 22°.

In any case, the airport owner emailed me this yesterday:

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It’s hard to get a sense of scale from that photo - the back wall is about 17’ tall.

Next step is to backfill with gravel and dirt, then the foundation per sé. Septic has been permitted - it requires a septic and a holding tank at hangar level, pumping the water up to a drain field at road level. Headed back up tomorrow and will report on any further progress.
 
Norman said:
A barn without Owls is just a barn. Who gives a hoot? :D Don't lie awake at night hoping they will see you are sleeping and want to disturb you. They have infinite patience.

When I was young owls loved to hoot as I was walking home in the dark and scaring the **** out of me.

Nuff said.
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I swear, one owl sits on the house and another sits in a tree, they talk to each other for an hour or so some nights. I should set up a camera.
 
Do yourself a favor and look up bridger steel. they have a great website and offer options unheard of out where we live. look for their corten and rustic rawhide.
 
And if you do decide to order from bridger steel let me know. I will be ordering some from them soon for my gatlinburg cabin rebuild. maybe we can save on shipping.
 
I’ll check that out, but pretty much going with what our contractor recommends.

This may give a better perspective on the height of the back wall (Karen is 5’ 5”)

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