AME contacted the FAA to "warn" them about me!

netsurfr

netsurfr

Pre-takeoff checklist
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Aug 30, 2014
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311
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Wisconsin
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Display name:
Jose
2 years ago when I went to renew my 3rd class I used an AME and told him that I got bronchitis as a result of a virus infection and as part of the temporary treatment I was given abuterol to use if needed. No big deal and went back to MD 1 month later and all clear of the mild asthma so in firther treatment or visit needed. The AME made me go get a pulmonary function test and results were fine so got my medical. Last mont i called him to schedule my renewal and first thing he tells me on he phone is did I go see a pulmonary specialist yet before I schedule the visit with him. I tell/remind him that it was an isolated issue and that I have not needed any further visits or treatment and that according to FAA info I do not need any special tests if I'm not under any medication. He then gets annoyed with my response and simply says "I'm not going opts argue with you. You need a specialist". At that point I decide I don't want to go back to this guy as I had reservations about him from the prior visit and with his comment I got the feeling this guy is making more of this than it needs to be so I tell him thanks but I will not be scheduling my visit with him and at was that. I scheduled with another AME disclosed the "asthma/bronchitis" incident i had in 2014 and he sees no problem or need to see specialists so issues my medical. Well 3 weeks later I get letter from FAA saying they want more info about my asthma! Long story short turned out the original AME wrote a letter to the FAA saying that I opted not to visit him and that I was likely trying to find an AME who would sign me off! Fortunately I worked with an AME who was suspicious of things and ordered my FAA medical and this is where we found a copy of the letter the AME wrote to the FAA. I had to go back to the MD I saw in 2014 to ask that he give me a checkup and write his assessment (in which he said I had an isolated incident due to virus and have required no medication or treatment and my lungs are at 100%). After all this being submitted to FAA they wrote back saying everything is fine and that they agree with new AME and my MD that I'm fine so got my medical BUT I'm livid about this AME basically trying to have the FAA flag my medical.

Is there any formal complaint one can file on AME's?
 
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netsurfr said:
2 years ago when I went to renew my 3rd class I used an AME and told him that I got bronchitis as a result of a virus infection and as part of the temporary treatment I was given abuterol to use if needed. No big deal and went back to MD 1 month later and all clear of the mild asthma so in firther treatment or visit needed. The AME made me go get a pulmonary function test and results were fine so got my medical. Last mont i called him to schedule my renewal and first thing he tells me on he phone is did I go see a pulmonary specialist yet before I schedule the visit with him. I tell/remind him that it was an isolated issue and that I have not needed any further visits or treatment and that according to FAA info I do not need any special tests if I'm not under any medication. He then gets annoyed with my response and simply says "I'm not going opts argue with you. You need a specialist". At that point I decide I don't want to go back to this guy as I had reservations about him from the prior visit and with his comment I got the feeling this guy is making more of this than it needs to be so I tell him thanks but I will not be scheduling my visit with him and at was that. I scheduled with another AME disclosed the "asthma/bronchitis" incident i had in 2014 and he sees no problem or need to see specialists so issues my medical. Well 3 weeks later I get letter from FAA saying they want more info about my asthma! Long story short turned out the original AME wrote a letter to the FAA saying that I opted not to visit him and that I was likely trying to find an AME who would sign me off and that I was likely going to lie about my condition and medications! Fortunately I worked with an AME who was suspicious of things and ordered my FAA medical and this is where we found a copy of the letter the AME wrote to the FAA. I had to go back to the MD I saw in 2014 to ask that he give me a checkup and write his assessment (in which he said I had an isolated incident due to virus and have required no medication or treatment and my lungs are at 100%). After all this being submitted to FAA they wrote back saying everything is fine and that they agree with new AME and my MD that I'm fine so got my medical BUT I'm livid about this AME basically trying to have the FAA pull my medical by telling them I was trying to lie and find a new AME who would issue medical.

I've since met 2 other pilots who feel this AME is also creating problems for them. This AME used to be a pilot but lost his medical so one gets the feeling lippthst he seems to be sour about that and taking out on applicants but that's pure speculation.

Is there any formal complaint one can file on AME's?
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I don't know about s formal complaint, but it sure would be nice to know who he is!
 
Depends on how much you want to spend?

Perhaps speak with the board who certified the doc?

Maybe legal action against him?

Not sure, but I'd want my pound of flesh if I was you.
 
netsurfr said:
...so I tell him thanks but I will not be scheduling my visit with him and at was that...
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Last year, I consulted with two local AMEs before deciding to engage Dr. Chien's services. I didn't feel that I had any obligation to tell either of the first two that I had decided to use someone else, so I didn't.
 
I'm not saying to fib on anything, just that the OP's situation is why one has to choose their AME carefully. I wouldn't just pick one off the FAA data base search. Talk to some local pilots and find one that is 'pilot friendly'.

Go elsewhere for routine medical checks.
 
I'd go fly.

You have it in wirting that this guy has exposed himself. Steeer clear of him...form a relationship with the new AME and burn Av-Gas.

If you tried to sue every one who needed suing, thats all you would ever do.
 
You can always report him to the state licensing board, but I wouldn't do that unless you felt he violated a rule.
 
You are tilting windmills. There are rectal openings in this world and you found one (shrug) Live and learn and move on.

As far as causing trouble (medical or legal) for him, ain't gonna happen - and attempting to do is likely to get you way more official attention than you want
Under his contractual responsibilities with the FAA/DOT he forwarded a concern about a medical issue involving an applicant. That is professional judgement protected by the weight of the entire US Government.

Move on dude.
And yeah, he is still a rectal opening.
 
Not looking at doing anything like suing but wondered if there was a formal way to submit a complaint about what this AME did. It sure was a learning experience for me about how important it is to pick a good AME. Still when I saw a copy of the letter he wrote to the FAA I was fuming. Doesn't sound like much can be done.
 
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Thinking a little more about it, I'd just put it all over Yelp, BBB, Google reviews etc
 
netsurfr said:
Not looking at doing anything like suing but wondered if there was a formal way to submit a complaint about what this AME did. It sure was a learning experience for me about how important it is to pick a good AME. Still when I saw a copy of the letter he wrote to the FAA I was fuming. Then by coincidence I learned of 2 other pilots going through similar issues with the same AME. My issue/problem was resolved relatively painlessly but I fear this AME is causing problems for others. Doesn't sound like much can be done.
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He's obviously an ass but what did he do illegal? Nothing. It's part of his responsibilities. I agree he's bitter and going out of his way to burn pilots but if he has a medical concern with a pilot than he's done nothing wrong. Hopefully the FAA will begin to see a trend with this ass and drop him, if they can. Meanwhile I'd get his name out there as someone to avoid.
 
Hope posting his name doesn't somehow come back to bite me so I'll say this.... This is merely my own experience and opinion. The AME is out of Milwaukee, WI. As background I'm 48 and very healthy. No medical issues, surgeries, problems and my medical history and annual physicals show this. I had only seen this AME 2 times (student pilot medical in 2012 & my first PPL renewal in 2014). Both times he gave me "flack" about something or another so I started wondering about him especially when he seemed to make a mountain out of a molehill with this isolated "asthma" issue in 2014 shortly before my renewal. He seemed eager to escalate my condition into an issue and wanted me to get letters & tests from a pulmonologist and although I felt he was blowing it out of proportion I went along with it in 2014 to get my renewal. I also didn't know any better back then. When I called him this year to renew and he starts off demanding/expecting I go see a specialist and get PFT's etc. before I see him, I decided that I needed a different AME as even the FAA info I read about "asthma" clearly said that if the applicant does not have persistent/chronic asthma or does not need medication on a regular basis (that's me) then further tests are not required. As I'm questioning why he wants me to do all this he abruptly tells me "I'm not going to argue with you about this you have to do this" and that's when I decided I should find a different AME so I told him so. I went to a different AME and told him exactly what I experienced in 2014 and he issued the medical BUT since he wrote this warning letter to the FAA stating that I lied on my medical record, the FAA flagged my record for further investigation no matter what and so when the new AME submitted the paperwork and issued the medical they pulled it aside and contacted me for further tests etc. I ended up contacting Dr. Bruce and he helped clear things up with the FAA to the extent that they actually removed/cleared me of Asthma without any need for a CACI or special issuance so clean bill of health (as it should have been from day 1). This should have never happened and it taught me that one has to be very careful of the AME you pick because at the very least they can make medical renewal a complicated/expensive/negative experience or worse, cause you to loose your medical and it appears there's no way to alert the FAA of potential red flags issues like mine. I would have never learned of the letter the AME wrote to the FAA had it not been for Dr. Bruce wanting to see my entire FAA medical record to see what the AME wrote in there. When I saw a copy of the letter I was shocked that this guy proactively tried to cause problems for me and went as far as saying I was not disclosing medications that I was currently using that I verbally told him about (not true).
 
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Wow. I used him for my last medical in 2013. He seemed really chill about most things and my exam was quick and simple. I even called him up about a few things since then (shingles, surgery), and he made it seem like it was no big deal as long as my primary doctor documented the issues as a one time thing with complete recovery. I wonder if he since then got in some sort of trouble with the FAA and is now cracking down. I may have to find a new AME now.
 
If by that you mean that he didn't believe me when I said I've had no need for further treatment or medication since that one incident in 2014 then yes but then again that means this AME assumed I'm lying in my medexpress app and on the phone and also ignores my medical record/history. I want to work with an AME who doesn't assume I'm a lying. My MD disagreed with him, 2 other AMEs disagreed with him, and ultimately the FAA disagreed as well. I'm lucky as this could have been a much harder and expensive battle for me to fight. Especially considering what he wrote to the FAA.

MAKG1 said:
It sounds exactly like he didn't believe your story.
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Been going to the same AME for awhile now. First time they saw the allopurinol they asked for a letter from my MD, which I got. Next time they asked for all kinds things. Claimed the FAA had cracked down them.
 
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netsurfr said:
Not looking at doing anything like suing but wondered if there was a formal way to submit a complaint about what this AME did. It sure was a learning experience for me about how important it is to pick a good AME. Still when I saw a copy of the letter he wrote to the FAA I was fuming. Then by coincidence I learned of 2 other pilots going through similar issues with the same AME. My issue/problem was resolved relatively painlessly but I fear this AME is causing problems for others. Doesn't sound like much can be done.
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The FAA and AMA have had a wonderful little circle jerk going since the 1950s. (Maybe earlier? Anyone know when the 3rd class medical requirement for private pilots came into existence?)

Both are huge bureaucracies that have been built, over time, to protect themselves from outside input. This all adds up to there being nothing you can effectively do about a bad egg AME. All you can do is grit your teeth and comply.

Keep your fingers crossed that the House passes PBOR2, and breaks the cartel. I'm not holding my breath, but hope springs eternal.
 
Aren't think the regional flight surgeons are responsible for the AMEs in their region? I don't know who your RFS is, but if you can find out, there might be some way to ask him to look into if your medical was handled appropriately. Your new AME doesn't seem to think it was, the RFS might have a different opinion based on circumstances.
 
You're right new AME believes my old AME was wrong and went way out of his way to make renewal difficult but also said I'd be wasting my time trying to complain about to the FAA.

Matthew said:
Aren't think the regional flight surgeons are responsible for the AMEs in their region? I don't know who your RFS is, but if you can find out, there might be some way to ask him to look into if your medical was handled appropriately. Your new AME doesn't seem to think it was, the RFS might have a different opinion based on circumstances.
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netsurfr said:
You're right new AME believes my old AME was wrong and went way out of his way to make renewal difficult but also said I'd be wasting my time trying to complain about to the FAA.
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Probably - In case you change your mind, I think the RFS is the next in line in the chain of command.
 
Based on what you say is stated in the letter to the FAA, the first AME submitted a libelous statement to a government agency. What would be even better is if you could show you already submitted a factually correct medical application before he wrote that letter. If you want to have some fun with him, write him a letter demanding financial compensation for any (enumerated) direct and indirect costs associated with having to straighten the situation out with the FAA, and that if he doesn't compensate you, you'll pursue legal action. Whether or not you actually choose to follow up with a lawyer is up to you, and probably not worth the time and cost.
 
May be a stretch, but might he have violated your HIPAA privacy rights? Does the AME designation give him the prerogative to disclose his suspicion? I don't know; just thinking out loud....
 
Jeff Oslick said:
If you want to have some fun with him, write him a letter demanding financial compensation for any (enumerated) direct and indirect costs associated with having to straighten the situation out with the FAA, and that if he doesn't compensate you, you'll pursue legal action. Whether or not you actually choose to follow up with a lawyer is up to you, and probably not worth the time and cost.
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THIS! I'd do this just to screw with him. :mad:;):D
 
Matthew said:
Is an AME is restricted by HIPAA? Dunno. He isn't your doctor, he's working for FAA.
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Since he did not actually apply with that AME this time around, I'm wondering if that eliminates any exemption from HIPAA provisions.

By the way, the last time I applied for a medical certificate, the AME's office staff asked me to sign a form authorizing him to release information to the FAA.
 
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This sucks, the guy seems like a turd. That said, I would leave it alone, its just not worth it. Truthfully, if it were me, I would delete my comments in this thread.
 
Yes, delete your comments, before some lawyer gets involved, let it go, it was a heartburn situation for sure, ( make sure you report that next time) but you got your medical, life is too short and these things only steal your joy.
 
Mistake here was telling him you were going somewhat else. Not sure why everyone now-a-days wants to drop a turd bomb on the guy they're ****ed off at ...

Keep responses short and sweet example:

1. I felt like crap
2. My doc gave me an inhalant to speed up a flu or upper respiratory infection recovery
3. Been 100% since

A friend of mine was going to give up flying as his AME told him he had an irregular heart beat. I told him, "Not so fast" ... I'm in medical imaging and know a bunch of great cardiologists. Long story short, cardiologists cleared him after a couple of months of paperwork, EKG, Echocardiogram ... he thought and was told by his original AME it was doubtful he would ever fly again. He has a benign positional irregular rhythm. I helped another guy that was told "abnormal EKG" ... the leads weren't placed correctly on the original EKG exam. Don't let anyone place leads on you that isn't a heart specialist.
 
mikeinbama said:
This sucks, the guy seems like a turd. That said, I would leave it alone, its just not worth it. Truthfully, if it were me, I would delete my comments in this thread.
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How sad...

So your fellow airmen can have the same experience the OP had?!

PLEASE, this is the great benifit of the web, post the FACTS, which he did about a bad experience to save others, just like a PIREP.

If you could spare one pilot the trouble you've had, why wouldn't you?

As long as you're posting facts, you got nothing the worry about.
 
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netsurfr said:
Hope posting his name doesn't somehow come back to bite me so I'll say this.... This is merely my own experience and opinion. The AME is [SADLY CENSORED] out of Milwaukee, WI. As background I'm 48 and very healthy. No medical issues, surgeries, problems and my medical history and annual physicals show this. I had only seen [CENSORED] 2 times (student pilot medical in 2012 & my first PPL renewal in 2014). Both times he gave me "flack" about something or another so I started wondering about him especially when he seemed to make a mountain out of a molehill with this isolated "asthma" issue in 2014 shortly before my renewal. He seemed eager to escalate my condition into an issue and wanted me to get letters & tests from a pulmonologist and although I felt he was blowing it out of proportion I went along with it in 2014 to get my renewal. I also didn't know any better back then. When I called him this year to renew and he starts off demanding/expecting I go see a specialist and get PFT's etc. before I see him, I decided that I needed a different AME as even the FAA info I read about "asthma" clearly said that if the applicant does not have persistent/chronic asthma or does not need medication on a regular basis (that's me) then further tests are not required. As I'm questioning why he wants me to do all this he abruptly tells me "I'm not going to argue with you about this you have to do this" and that's when I decided I should find a different AME so I told him so. I went to a different AME and told him exactly what I experienced in 2014 and he issued the medical BUT since [CENSORED] wrote this warning letter to the FAA and actually said that I was likely going to lie about my condition and/or use of medications the FAA flagged my record for further investigation no matter what and so when the new AME submitted the paperwork and issued the medical they pulled it aside and contacted me for further tests etc. I ended up contacting Dr. Bruce and he helped clear things up with the FAA to the extent that they actually removed/cleared me of Asthma (a condition assigned to me due to [CENSORED] write up in 2014) without any need for a CACI or special issuance so clean bill of health (as it should have been from day 1). This should have never happened and it taught me that one has to be very careful of the AME you pick because at the very least they can make medical renewal a complicated/expensive/negative experience or worse, cause you to loose your medical and it appears there's no way to alert the FAA of potential red flags issues like mine. I would have never learned of the letter [CENSORED]. wrote to the FAA had it not been for Dr. Bruce wanting to see my entire FAA medical record to see what [CENSORED] wrote in there. When I saw a copy of the letter I was shocked that this guy proactively tried to cause problems for me and went as far as saying I was possibly going to LIE to a different AME in order to get a medical issued and that I was not disclosing medications that I was currently using that I verbally told him off (not true).
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THANK YOU FOR THE PIREP!
 
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You have your medical. Be thankful and move on. Getting frustrated is letting him win.


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If he's flapping his yap two or three years later, about your medical information, you might have something actionable. Or not, depending on Fed law. . .unless he literally said, in writing, that you were "likely to lie". I'd wonder too about his offering an (unqualified) opinion on a transient medical event that was several years old, without examining you.

Regardless of the regs, raise at least a little heck with your Congressman and Senator, and FAA; at a minimum, someone at FAA will likely have to respond to the inquiry from a Hill staffer, maybe also inconvenience this guy a bit, as well. If we all do a bit to make life a bit less pleasant for these pukes, some of them might occasionally back off this kind of nonsense. It's not so important whether he was within the rules - it's more important that what he did should not/not be within the rules. Anyway, dash off a couple notes to your elected officials (unless you aren't registered to vote - then it's pointless); and one to the FAA Administrator.

Maybe he was hoping you wouldn't disclose, and so get you slapped for lying to the next AME (and the FAA). . .
 
James331 said:
How sad...

So your fellow airmen can have the same experience the OP had?!

PLEASE, this is the great benifit of the web, post the FACTS, which he did about a bad experience to save others, just like a PIREP.

If you could spare one pilot the trouble you've had, why wouldn't you?

As long as you're posting facts, you got nothing the worry about.[/QUOTE]
If only this were true. To each his own.
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