ZOA Question

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Richard Palm
When I took a tour of Oakland Center many years ago, I found out that they're really in Fremont. If I call them "Fremont Center" some day, do you think they would appreciate the joke, think (i.e, find out) that I'm a dufus, or just go "Huh???"
 
When I took a tour of Oakland Center many years ago, I found out that they're really in Fremont. If I call them "Fremont Center" some day, do you think they would appreciate the joke, think (i.e, find out) that I'm a dufus, or just go "Huh???"

Technically, they're in Hayward...
 
ATL Center is in Hampton GA, near the Atlanta Motor Speedway. I guess 30 miles away.
 
Most of them are located outside of the city proper, the idea being in the event of an attack they will be protected.
 
Most of them are located outside of the city proper, the idea being in the event of an attack they will be protected.

LOL....or, the more reasonable explanation...it was cheaper to be located in the ****hole that is fremont, than it was in oakland?
 
When I took a tour of Oakland Center many years ago, I found out that they're really in Fremont. If I call them "Fremont Center" some day, do you think they would appreciate the joke, think (i.e, find out) that I'm a dufus, or just go "Huh???"

You might get any reaction. My guess is most likely it would come across as kinda dufusey. It never happened to me but I probably woulda thought, big deal, so you know where we are.
 
LOL....or, the more reasonable explanation...it was cheaper to be located in the ****hole that is fremont, than it was in oakland?

That's actually what we we're told in ATC school as well. It's an old Cold War thing. They wanted the ARTCCs located out away from major cities in the event of a nuclear war.

JAX Center, not even in Jacksonville. It's in the middle of nowhere in Hillard FL.
 
That's actually what we we're told in ATC school as well. It's an old Cold War thing. They wanted the ARTCCs located out away from major cities in the event of a nuclear war.

I've heard that OWT too. Of course, if they were silly enough to believe controllers were going to hang around and do stuff at them in the fallout and later nuclear winter, well... anyway.

Don't forget: North Dakota still has enough nukes to plaster most of the planet. Try not to **** them off. :)
 
I've heard that OWT too. Of course, if they were silly enough to believe controllers were going to hang around and do stuff at them in the fallout and later nuclear winter, well... anyway.

Don't forget: North Dakota still has enough nukes to plaster most of the planet. Try not to **** them off. :)

Well if it's been hardened properly, I suppose they expected them to be around...for a little while at least.

http://www.zlcalumni.com/history-through-1966
 
Well if it's been hardened properly, I suppose they expected them to be around...for a little while at least.

http://www.zlcalumni.com/history-through-1966

I think any sense of duty one felt would be pretty much over with in the first 24 hours. If that long.

He old joke applies. Mechanical and electrical engineers make weapons, civil engineers make targets. ;)
 
I think any sense of duty one felt would be pretty much over with in the first 24 hours. If that long.

He old joke applies. Mechanical and electrical engineers make weapons, civil engineers make targets. ;)

I don't know about sense of duty but if I found an "aviation soul mate" in the facility, I could continue on living in the nuclear aftermath.
 
LOL....or, the more reasonable explanation...it was cheaper to be located in the ****hole that is fremont, than it was in oakland?

My understanding is that Fremont is a lot less of a xxxxhole than Oakland!
 
My understanding is that Fremont is a lot less of a xxxxhole than Oakland!

I don't know anything about either one but I suspect once you need waders, a full face mask, and a septic truck, the differences don't matter much after that. ;)
 
By the way, does anyone know whether Oakland Center was ever located in Oakland?
 
If I call the Detroit Pistons the Auburn Hills Pistons...see where this is going?
 
The 2013 crime rate in Oakland was almost seven times what it was in Fremont.

http://www.city-data.com/crime/crime-Oakland-California.html

http://www.city-data.com/crime/crime-Fremont-California.html

I've heard that Oakland has been improving since then, but I don't have the numbers.

But to answer your question, Oakland is one of those "hip/cool" places to live...I'm willing to bet rent is substantially higher in oakland than in fremont...no matter how good your chances are of being murdered.

Plus, Fremont is more flat, I think...less hill/mountains to get in the way of radio transmissions.
 
But to answer your question, Oakland is one of those "hip/cool" places to live...I'm willing to bet rent is substantially higher in oakland than in fremont...no matter how good your chances are of being murdered.

Plus, Fremont is more flat, I think...less hill/mountains to get in the way of radio transmissions.
I never thought of Oakland as being "hip" or "cool" but there are good neighborhoods and bad. The better areas are towards the hills. They have also cleaned up the area around Lake Merritt.
 
I never thought of Oakland as being "hip" or "cool" but there are good neighborhoods and bad. The better areas are towards the hills. They have also cleaned up the area around Lake Merritt.

Don't get me wrong...from someone who has lived in SF for close to 27 years, I still see Oakland as a crime-ravaged city. The exorbitant prices of living in SF have forced a lot of people out to oakland, and the neighborhoods are slowly improving because of the gentrification. As a matter of fact, the hipster population of oakland has exploded in recent years. With all of this, rent is steadily rising as well.

And, as we all know, hipsters always live in the cool part of town.
 
Don't get me wrong...from someone who has lived in SF for close to 27 years, I still see Oakland as a crime-ravaged city. The exorbitant prices of living in SF have forced a lot of people out to oakland, and the neighborhoods are slowly improving because of the gentrification. As a matter of fact, the hipster population of oakland has exploded in recent years. With all of this, rent is steadily rising as well.

And, as we all know, hipsters always live in the cool part of town.
I'm not part of the hipster scene, but I have relatives who live in the Oakland hills and it's pretty nice. I know they get odd looks when they say they live in Oakland, though. My family is native to the SF area. In fact I have a condo in SF. I also learned how to fly at Oakland airport many years ago, and was back for SB50 (the passengers went, not us). They put us up in a hotel on the estuary. I was wondering about the neighborhood, but as long as you stayed on the estuary side it was pretty nice.
 
I'm not part of the hipster scene, but I have relatives who live in the Oakland hills and it's pretty nice. I know they get odd looks when they say they live in Oakland, though. My family is native to the SF area. In fact I have a condo in SF. I also learned how to fly at Oakland airport many years ago, and was back for SB50 (the passengers went, not us). They put us up in a hotel on the estuary. I was wondering about the neighborhood, but as long as you stayed on the estuary side it was pretty nice.

Fair enough...but you know that saying the Oakland Hills are the same thing as Oakland is like saying that Henderson is the same as Las Vegas....

While TECHNICALLY, Oakland Hills may be part of Oakland, they are two VASTLY different places.

Next time you're in town, let me know. We'll grab a beer.
 
But to answer your question, Oakland is one of those "hip/cool" places to live...I'm willing to bet rent is substantially higher in oakland than in fremont...no matter how good your chances are of being murdered.

Plus, Fremont is more flat, I think...less hill/mountains to get in the way of radio transmissions.

There are some very nice neighborhoods in Oakland, and some very not nice ones, so I'm sure that rents vary widely within the city. As for the terrain situation and its effect on radio propagation, there's no significant difference. If anything, Fremont has higher terrain nearby than Oakland does.
 
Washington Center is in Leesburg, VA.

Nobody ever gets things right in the press. We had a story about a controller at ZDC arrested on drug charges. Turns out he was a flight service specialist at the Leesburg AFSS. Next I saw an article on central flow but the pictures are the PCT Tracon (the one taken the one time in it's history when the room lights were on).
 
I think any sense of duty one felt would be pretty much over with in the first 24 hours. If that long.

He old joke applies. Mechanical and electrical engineers make weapons, civil engineers make targets. ;)

Interesting, when I worked at a known primary target (Minuteman ICBM site) abandoning my duty or duty station post strike never crossed my mind.
 
Interesting, when I worked at a known primary target (Minuteman ICBM site) abandoning my duty or duty station post strike never crossed my mind.

Well a couple of assumptions were in my comment about leaving the Center...

- Massive destruction, not localized. As in MAD type scenarios.
- Whatever we call SCATANA today had been implemented. Nothing's flying anyway except your buddies in uniforms. You guys have AWACS and similar assets, you probably don't need the Center kids hanging around and they probably wouldn't last long anyway.
- Controllers say at, ZDV, take a gander from the parking lot and see the horizon glowing to the south (DEN) and north (CYS / FE Warren) and decide there's really no point in hanging around waiting for a nice northerly or southerly wind shift, and the only way "out" might be up US 287 toward Laramie, if they feel like surviving.
- If they feel like not surviving, a drive north up I-25 a ways toward FE Warren should take care of that in a relatively painful and gross week or so of vomiting and losing hair, skin, and other lovely maladies.

You guys down in the holes may have had it a little better than folks in a "blast certified" blockhouse on the surface... at least for a while. And assuming the yield assumptions were correct about how far down y'all needed to be. :) :) :)

I always got a kick out of knowing before the Bell System breakup that numerous COs for both local and AT&T were "hardened", including some of the microwave sites feeding the kids down at NORAD. I have the engineering drawings of the outhouse used at those sites, and I'll be the first to say it'd be stripped off the mountain and gone... it wasn't rated... so if you hung out inside and survived the attack at one of the microwave sites, indoors, you could come outside to enjoy the effects of the air burst that wiped the tower off the face of the earth... yay! Let's go outside! LOL... but it was fun to see the "Fallout Shelter" signs at telecom sites and radio sites in the 90s, all left there long after AT&T sold the place. Always had nice big generator diesel tanks at those sites... :)

But hey, we've gotten better at this emergency management stuff. Remember our latest one where they told us duct tape would save us? ROFLMAO...

Us above-ground-pounder civvies on the surface never had much of a good option, back in those days. And here I say that like "it's over", but of course, it really isn't. We just don't get the weekly "Alert" drills from the city sirens anymore, and nobody believes "Duck and Cover" crap like they might have back then. Glad y'all would stay in the hole, but my assumption above was that you'd already launched...

Unlimited nuclear war is a total **** sandwich no matter how or where you are.
 
The 2013 crime rate in Oakland was almost seven times what it was in Fremont.

http://www.city-data.com/crime/crime-Oakland-California.html

http://www.city-data.com/crime/crime-Fremont-California.html

I've heard that Oakland has been improving since then, but I don't have the numbers.

Richard,

Something to keep in mind...

In a typical year, 100 people are murdered in Oakland.

Oakland is 78 square miles... 95 of those 100 murders take place in a 10 block by 10 block area, or less than one square mile.

My advice? Stay out of that drug dealers' den... Buy your drugs elsewhere, and you'll be fine.

Paul, in Oakland
 
...Oakland is 78 square miles... 95 of those 100 murders take place in a 10 block by 10 block area, or less than one square mile.

My advice? Stay out of that drug dealers' den... Buy your drugs elsewhere, and you'll be fine....

I have absolutely no concern about going to my cousin's house in Oakland. Like I said, "There are some very nice neighborhoods in Oakland, and some very not nice ones..."
 
I don't think the name has anything to do with where they are at. Its the sector they are controlling. Its all over remote radios and VoIP these days... Hence,"Switch to my frequency" when you talking to the same guy but crossed from one sector to another.
 
When I took a tour of Oakland Center many years ago, I found out that they're really in Fremont. If I call them "Fremont Center" some day, do you think they would appreciate the joke, think (i.e, find out) that I'm a dufus, or just go "Huh???"

Those two.
 
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