What plane is right for me

mulligan

mulligan

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Mulligan
We are a family of five and would like to take weekend trips to the beach. Our main location is approximately 220 miles by air and would also sometimes go 650 miles to another location.

Would like something in the range of $250k to $500k

Also, when looking at planes on a site like controller, how negotiable are the asking prices? When we bought our bus, even bus was basically 27-30% off listed price. Are airplanes similar to that or are the asking prices actually what they think they can get.

Thanks
 
mulligan said:
We are a family of five and would like to take weekend trips to the beach. Our main location is approximately 220 miles by air and would also sometimes go 650 miles to another location.

Would like something in the range of $250k to $500k

Also, when looking at planes on a site like controller, how negotiable are the asking prices? When we bought our bus, even bus was basically 27-30% off listed price. Are airplanes similar to that or are the asking prices actually what they think they can get.

Thanks
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Cessna 210.... Or a 207..
 
I would also look at a newer 206 slightly used. you can most likely find one just under the 500k mark with the glass cockpit, terrain, traffic system and all the modern goodies. that would be my vote if your in the market for a used bird for 5 up to 500k
 
mulligan said:
We are a family of five and would like to take weekend trips to the beach. Our main location is approximately 220 miles by air and would also sometimes go 650 miles to another location.

Would like something in the range of $250k to $500k

Also, when looking at planes on a site like controller, how negotiable are the asking prices? When we bought our bus, even bus was basically 27-30% off listed price. Are airplanes similar to that or are the asking prices actually what they think they can get.

Thanks
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Need more info. Tell us more about the passengers...are we talking small kids or full grown adults? Luggage?

What are the pilot's qualifications?

Where are these trips? Over flat land or across mountain ranges?

What is your operating budget? 250-500 is a wide budget....does that include a maintenance reserve as well?

There are lots of options in your price range, but like everything, it depends...
 
I'm a big guy. 250. Wife 160ish and three boys, 14, 11, 9. For weekend travel can pack light. Can even leave clothes at weekend house unless going to other beach. Maybe say another 100lbs. Currently working on VFR but will then immediately work on IFR. East coast travel from BHM to gulf coast and south Florida. Maintenance should not be an issue. Hope that is enough info.
 
Lol, "When we bought our bus" :lol:

Aviation is a little different than buying a frikin' bus to drive around!


To your question, a U206 with extensions and a 550 or a 207 would do the trick.
 
Most airplane purchases are conditional on a satisfactory buyer-funded inspection. Price is sometimes negotiated after the inspection, and it's not uncommon to have the price altered by 10-15% or more (depending on what the plane needs and how important it is). I wouldn't expect you to find a plane that you can negotiate 30% off, unless it needs the same 30% in repairs/upgrades.
 
mulligan said:
I'm a big guy. 250. Wife 160ish and three boys, 14, 11, 9. For weekend travel can pack light. Can even leave clothes at weekend house unless going to other beach. Maybe say another 100lbs. Currently working on VFR but will then immediately work on IFR. East coast travel from BHM to gulf coast and south Florida. Maintenance should not be an issue. Hope that is enough info.
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PA-32 fixed or retracts, I.E. Cherokee Six 300, or Lance/Saratoga. Adjust fuel to accommodate load.

Definitely get instrument rating. You'll need it if you're flying more than just 100nm day trips.
 
Lease a Cessna Caravan,
 
Cherokee Six or fixed gear Lance. Both are variants of the Piper PA32. As a new pilot, you will have no difficulty getting insured in one at reasonable expense. At the distance you are planning to go, the speed you would gain from a retract is not very relevant. With 3 boys, you have anticipate rapid weight gain. Cherokee Six versions have around 1500 useful some of which has to be taken as fuel (in aircraft that have a zero-fuel weight). At your budget, you can find some that have been completely re-done in terms of interior, paint and avionics.

The other option is a 206.
 
There's a lot to be said for a good A-36. Most places know how to work on Bonanzas, parts aren't too hard to come by, and the double doors at the back will make loading and unloading much easier. They are fairly fast and well under budget, which will pay for operations costs, annuals, insurance and Instrument training, after which it will be wonderful traveling.

Some are even available with factory air conditioning, which will be incredibly valuable in AL and FL.
 
My seller only came down 2% but I think it was priced pretty fair to begin with. My initial offer was 5% under the asking price and no way was that going to happen.
 
weilke said:
Cherokee Six or fixed gear Lance. Both are variants of the Piper PA32. As a new pilot, you will have no difficulty getting insured in one at reasonable expense. At the distance you are planning to go, the speed you would gain from a retract is not very relevant. With 3 boys, you have anticipate rapid weight gain. Cherokee Six versions have around 1500 useful some of which has to be taken as fuel (in aircraft that have a zero-fuel weight). At your budget, you can find some that have been completely re-done in terms of interior, paint and avionics.

The other option is a 206.
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I think you mean a fixed gear Saratoga... there are no fixed-gear Lance's. :)

An expensive one would be less than 250k, so you should be good on the budget. While they are certainly load haulers, they are slower. Retract will add about 10 knots, and find one with a Lopresti cowl and you'll add another 10-15 knots. Mine cruises at 160-165 knots true.

A PA-32 is definitely the SUV of the skies.
 
mulligan said:
We are a family of five and would like to take weekend trips to the beach. Our main location is approximately 220 miles by air and would also sometimes go 650 miles to another location.

Would like something in the range of $250k to $500k

Also, when looking at planes on a site like controller, how negotiable are the asking prices? When we bought our bus, even bus was basically 27-30% off listed price. Are airplanes similar to that or are the asking prices actually what they think they can get.

Thanks
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Who is going to fly the plane?
 
mulligan said:
I'm a big guy. 250. Wife 160ish and three boys, 14, 11, 9. For weekend travel can pack light. Can even leave clothes at weekend house unless going to other beach. Maybe say another 100lbs. Currently working on VFR but will then immediately work on IFR. East coast travel from BHM to gulf coast and south Florida. Maintenance should not be an issue. Hope that is enough info.
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Cherokee 6.
 
Hank S said:
There's a lot to be said for a good A-36. Most places know how to work on Bonanzas, parts aren't too hard to come by, and the double doors at the back will make loading and unloading much easier. They are fairly fast and well under budget, which will pay for operations costs, annuals, insurance and Instrument training, after which it will be wonderful traveling.

Some are even available with factory air conditioning, which will be incredibly valuable in AL and FL.
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Bonanza is going to be snug for the pilot and the rapidly growing boys.
 
You mentioned your purchase budget, but what is your budget per year to operate it?

"The best plane is the one that you can afford to keep, operate, and maintain" -- B. Chien

It's one thing to say you can spend $200k one time to acquire. But can you afford $50-100-150 annually to keep it nice, and legal, and fly it?
 
ahkahn said:
I think you mean a fixed gear Saratoga... there are no fixed-gear Lance's. :)
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Yes. Taper-wing Six. They put them back on the market as 'Six XT' in the 2000s, those had poor useful load compared with the old models. Some shops upgrade the late model Sixes to modern looks and avionics while maintaining useful load. Those could be an option given his generous budget.

As I understand it, he is a new pilot. I have an A36 and with the STCs we have, the useful load would be sufficient for his cabin load. Insurance expense fresh out of training is going to be considerably higher than a fixed-gear PA32, particularly if he gets a nice one in the >250k range. There is considerable expense in upgrading, but if the Six or a 206 can do the job speed wise, he may not have the itch to upgrade for a very long time.
 
weilke said:
Yes. Taper-wing Six. They put them back on the market as 'Six XT' in the 2000s, those had poor useful load compared with the old models. Some shops upgrade the late model Sixes to modern looks and avionics while maintaining useful load. Those could be an option given his generous budget.

As I understand it, he is a new pilot. I have an A36 and with the STCs we have, the useful load would be sufficient for his cabin load. Insurance expense fresh out of training is going to be considerably higher than a fixed-gear PA32, particularly if he gets a nice one in the >250k range. There is considerable expense in upgrading, but if the Six or a 206 can do the job speed wise, he may not have the itch to upgrade for a very long time.
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As a point of reference, when I bought my Lance, I had been quoted as a VFR pilot with 200 hours. Best quote came in around $2000/year for insurance. Now I'm IFR with 400+ hours, so I'm expecting to see it drop nicely this year.
 
as a 5 hour student pilot, i was quoted 2,400/year for a Cherokee 6/300, but they required 25 hours of dual instruction before I could solo it. After that, all bets were off.

I still may end up buing one before I finish PPL, since either way I have to do 25 hours of dual for the insurance
 
If a difference of $700 per year for insurance for one or two years keeps a guy with a "$250k to $500k" budget from buying then he has bigger problems. lol

It has been well established on this board that low time private pilots with normal backgrounds can get insured for piston aircraft of the types described in the thread.
 
The Cherokee six or a Saratoga retracs would be my choice.
 
Subsea said:
Most airplane purchases are conditional on a satisfactory buyer-funded inspection. Price is sometimes negotiated after the inspection, and it's not uncommon to have the price altered by 10-15% or more (depending on what the plane needs and how important it is). I wouldn't expect you to find a plane that you can negotiate 30% off, unless it needs the same 30% in repairs/upgrades.
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Not sure I would want a plane that I just negotiated down 30%... means something is wrong with it...
 
Seems like a GA-8 Airvan would work, they're similar to a 207.
 
OkieAviator said:
Not sure I would want a plane that I just negotiated down 30%... means something is wrong with it...
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True enough. Could also mean that it was mispriced to begin with and had sat on the market a long time. It's surprising what some people think their planes are worth.

Anyway, you wouldn't likely have the bargaining power to bring the price down that much unless it had sat a long time or unless you'd done a pre-buy and actually documented something wrong with it.
 
mulligan said:
We are a family of five and would like to take weekend trips to the beach. Our main location is approximately 220 miles by air and would also sometimes go 650 miles to another location.

Would like something in the range of $250k to $500k

Also, when looking at planes on a site like controller, how negotiable are the asking prices? When we bought our bus, even bus was basically 27-30% off listed price. Are airplanes similar to that or are the asking prices actually what they think they can get.

Thanks
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With this limited mission information I would have to say a turbo stationair simply because it's going to be your one size fits all turnkey airplane.

With a 206 you can decide later if you want to do back country flying, or floats, or take the seats out for a big cargo hauler. The choices are there. When it comes to the latest greatest load lifting traveling machine, the 206 still stands out. Yes a Bonanza will get you there a few minutes faster, but that's all it does better.

You should be able to find a good TAA version for less than $500K.
 
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Similar mission and experience profile. I had 150 hrs and had just finished my IR when I bought my '99 T206H. Wife, two kids (11 and 7) plus two dogs to our ranch 200 nm away.
Very happy with the choice!! I wanted new so that limited my options.
I now have 250 hrs in it and while I do wish it was 20 kts faster, it's a great plane. I have 1250 useful. No issues with w&b yet. At max it flies no different.
I bought mine w/factory avionics then had an Aspen, GTN 750/650, MVP 50, GDL 88 and 69 installed. Really wanted AC so I planned on tip,tanks and AC install but after flying for a summer my wife said its not necessary. With the windows open on both sides it's tolerable on the ground and cooler air is only a few minutes after departure.
U won't find a Bonanza with the room a 206 has. Got 3 Buddies with Bos and they all concede that for what I need this is the only SEP that'll really work.
Oh, first year insurance was $5500. This year I paid $4200.


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mulligan said:
We are a family of five and would like to take weekend trips to the beach. Our main location is approximately 220 miles by air and would also sometimes go 650 miles to another location.

Would like something in the range of $250k to $500k

Also, when looking at planes on a site like controller, how negotiable are the asking prices? When we bought our bus, even bus was basically 27-30% off listed price. Are airplanes similar to that or are the asking prices actually what they think they can get.

Thanks
Click to expand...

What ratings do you have? How many hours ? Inst. rating? So important before chosing anything.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
What ratings do you have? How many hours ? Inst. rating? So important before chosing anything.
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Just getting PPl and then will work on IR. Was thinking of getting one for a year or two while working on IFR and flying with just wife or a buddy. Liked he Cirrus as a two person plane for me to get some hours and practice in. Then will move up to something like the t206h that some are recommending for the extra passengers and weight. Like the glass cockpit in the cirrus and the caps option but the Cessna are great options too. In fact, maybe even better to start with something like cirrus to build hours and experience and then go to twin engine instead of single piston. Lots of Looking and research ahead. Not going to rush into it and just enjoy the eye candy out there!
 
Jimmy cooper said:
What ratings do you have? How many hours ? Inst. rating? So important before chosing anything.
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That's why a generic like a 206 is being thrown out so much because if you can fly a 172 you can fly one. VFR, IFR, it doesn't make any difference, and all of them are going to be IFR planes. Most 206's are.

Going from a 150 or 172 to a 206 is like going from your first High School short bed pickup to a F-350 King Ranch dually long bed. It's still a pickup. Just bigger and fancier.

If I hit a billion dollar lotto tonight I'd be on the horn tomorrow for a brand new one. Heck, send it to Tod Peterson and build me a King Katmai Turbo Staitionair on amphibs while you're at it! :wink2:
 
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I'm not partial. You really need a Malibu. It's what everybody wants.
 
Well, as the OP I wanted to give an update on where I was. I took the wife to the flight school today and got her in the following. Bonanza G36, Cirrus SR22, Piper Saratoga, and a Cessna 182 as there was no 206 on hand to sit in. After sitting in all of them in both front and back, she gave the owner the go ahead to call the insurance company to see if we bought the 206, could we get insured to complete my training in that plane. The insurance agent said absolutely she could get us insured and explained it would be expensive until IFR rating and hours were built up but would still be better than buying a 182 now and trading in on a 206 later when taking into account inspections, use, etc.... As we left the hangar, she gave the owner the go ahead to find us a gently used Cessna 206h turbo to purchase asap. Woohoo. We went to lunch and celebrated. While we don't own anything yet, it was a big step getting to the final selection phase. Thanks for all of your input.
 
Excellent news! Keep us abreast of your progress!
 
Congrats, thats a good plane for you. As someone mentioned earlier, the Cessnas are better to fly in the summer without AC due to the big windows on the doors. I assume the 206 is like the other high wing cessnas I have flown.

If I could afford it, the plane in that class I would buy is the T210. I like high wings, lots of shade, easier to load/unload (esp in the rain).
 
Very good choice!!
Don't forget about the crank AD and make sure u check the exhaust manifold and turbo during the pre buy.


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