Exhausting questions ...

txflyer

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Fly it like you STOL it ♦
The old NOS cracked exhaust stacks are off, and she's ready for the new Knisley slip joint stacks and Colmonoy muffler. Initial bench fit of the new stacks and muffler is perfect! :)

One question ... do you put any kind of sealant or dope on the slip joint?

 
The old NOS cracked exhaust stacks are off, and she's ready for the new Knisley slip joint stacks and Colmonoy muffler. Initial bench fit of the new stacks and muffler is perfect! :)

One question ... do you put any kind of sealant or dope on the slip joint?


Nope...... Let it slip
 
Mouse milk.


The new joint doesn't need any lubricant to slip inside itself. It fits easily.

Almost too easily was why I was wondering if there is going to be any blow-by, hence some kind of special exhaust dope .... :dunno:
 
The new joint doesn't need any lubricant to slip inside itself. It fits easily.

Almost too easily was why I was wondering if there is going to be any blow-by, hence some kind of special exhaust dope .... :dunno:

Nope, the inner pipe will run hotter then the outer" slip female" pipe and it will grow larger to seal that joint....

Expansion is a wonderful thing...:yes::yes:
 
Nope, the inner pipe will run hotter then the outer" slip female" pipe and it will grow larger to seal that joint....

Expansion is a wonderful thing...:yes::yes:


Thanks. That eases my mind.

It sure looks better than the old 1/4 inch slip joint with clamps. :yesnod:
 
One question ... do you put any kind of sealant or dope on the slip joint?

Put some Silver antiseize on the joint, the next person trying to get it apart won't cuss as much. :)
 
It's far from necessary, but I polish the joints, I may even polish the whole pipe.;)

Do you realize that Stainless steel of all varieties corrode to protect the base metal?

So you polish it, clamp it together, heat it and now it will weld itself together. no slip. = cracks just like he had before.

Remember these pipes glow white hot at full power.
 
Do you realize that Stainless steel of all varieties corrode to protect the base metal?

So you polish it, clamp it together, heat it and now it will weld itself together. no slip. = cracks just like he had before.

Remember these pipes glow white hot at full power.

Oxidizes, yes I do, and I also know that if I start that process from a clean, high polish surface, it is a stronger, more impervious to corrosion, surface than if I start from a mill surface. It's not a big difference in any way, that's for sure, but it also reduces galling at high temp. Just pithy detail crap that may or may not extend the service life of the part, but surely won't hurt.
 
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Put some Silver antiseize on the joint, the next person trying to get it apart won't cuss as much. :)



Since I have one side up and in place just hand tight, I think I'll forego putting anything on it. But thanks and I understand your suggestion. And I won't be polishing it, I have enough to polish. :D

If it won't slip out the next time, it isn't too hard to take all the bolts off and drop the whole thing..

A shaved 7/16 socket sure helps. By shaved I mean it's ground down thinner on the nut end than the wrench end.
 
Since I have one side up and in place just hand tight, I think I'll forego putting anything on it. But thanks and I understand your suggestion. And I won't be polishing it, I have enough to polish. :D

If it won't slip out the next time, it isn't too hard to take all the bolts off and drop the whole thing..

A shaved 7/16 socket sure helps. By shaved I mean it's ground down thinner on the nut end than the wrench end.

:rofl: I still have that socket, I ground down a short 1/4drive swivel socket. That and a 3' extension and exhaust is pretty easy.
 
I'm with Tom D on the anti-seize. Sure makes it easier the next time a cylinder has to be removed.
 
Do you realize that Stainless steel of all varieties corrode to protect the base metal?

So you polish it, clamp it together, heat it and now it will weld itself together. no slip. = cracks just like he had before.

Remember these pipes glow white hot at full power.

Once again, Tom is 100% correct..... EGT's run 1350-1450+... That is hotter then the over top burner on your stove....:yikes::yikes:..

Do that for 500 -1500 hours till a cylinder needs replacing and I can assure you.. Any product like mouse milk, anti seize or any other stuff know to mankind will be LONG gone.. Can you say "vaporized"...:yes:.......;)..

In fact, some stuff might even carbonize and prevent future removal...:mad2:
 
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Once again, Tom is 100% correct..... EGT's run 1350-1450+... That is hotter then the over top burner on your stove....:yikes::yikes:..

Do that for 500 -1500 hours till a cylinder needs replacing and I can assure you.. Any product like mouse milk, anti seize or any other stuff know to mankind will be LONG gone.. Can you say "vaporized"...:yes:.......;)..

In fact, some stuff might even carbonize and prevent future removal...:mad2:
actually the nickel anti seize jesse pointed out is good to about 1800 degrees f.
I discovered it when working on the RR Dart and Alison T-56, it stops the burner can from seizing and allows it to move around rather than cracking. It also works better than the copper on spark plugs.

OBTW, a brass nut is a lot better than the steel ones used here.
 
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Put some Silver antiseize on the joint, the next person trying to get it apart won't cuss as much. :)

Gotta agree 100% - I was the "cuss-er" during last year's annual. Couldn't get apart if our lives depended on it. We were replacing the muffler and to drill it, we needed these apart. Tried torches, penetrating oil, cheater pipes for leverage, etc. No way these were coming apart. Won't guarantee that the next guy down the line won't suffer the same, but with silver anti-seize I suspect he'll have a fighting chance.....

(don't get me started on the suggestion of one person - (ATF/Acetone and a woman's "toy" bungee'd to it for several days to "vibrate" the solution down in there....obviously a 110v, not the C cell variety....:eek:) We didn't go quite that far with it....
 
:rofl: I still have that socket, I ground down a short 1/4drive swivel socket. That and a 3' extension and exhaust is pretty easy.


Yes, many different length extensions .... :yesnod:

What I'm finding is starting some of the flange nuts when re-assembling is turning into a beeyach. A couple of them won't start to save my ass. The angle of the dangle just isn't right and you can't get your fingers up in there.

I'm going to try one of those flexible grabber tools today for the hard to start nuts. If I can just get them started, the shaved socket should work ...
 
Try a little masking tape around the flex portion of the socket. It makes it more stable.
 
Yes, many different length extensions .... :yesnod:

What I'm finding is starting some of the flange nuts when re-assembling is turning into a beeyach. A couple of them won't start to save my ass. The angle of the dangle just isn't right and you can't get your fingers up in there.

I'm going to try one of those flexible grabber tools today for the hard to start nuts. If I can just get them started, the shaved socket should work ...

That is where a 3' extension, quality swivel socket, finesse, a lot of zen, and a dose of good karma come in. The swivel has to be stiff enough to hold position above an extension at an angle. Then you oh so carefully thread it up through the path and get it square to the stud, apply just the right (light) amount of pressure up and gently rotate the extension in your finger tips.

The 3' extension comes in on these, as does the one piece swivel socket. The key is to eliminate every wobble point you can.

BTW, if you start with a Snap On socket, you do a lot less grinding.
 
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actually the nickel anti seize jesse pointed out is good to about 1800 degrees f.

And I discovered it because Tom told me about it. Works great :)
 
It's far from necessary, but I polish the joints, I may even polish the whole pipe.;)


Henning... We don't want to hear about you polishing your pipe. Haha. Really.

Anti-seize however, truly is magical stuff.
 
Henning... We don't want to hear about you polishing your pipe. Haha. Really.

Anti-seize however, truly is magical stuff.

I have nothing against anti seize either, but it's a different, complimentary, issue. I have done significant fabrications for use in extreme environments and know what we do there and why. While the difference it has on an exhaust system is likely insignificant, especially in the light of anti seize, it still exists, besides, polished pipes look good and radiate less heat.
 
The flexible grabber tool worked great for starting the nuts.

Another trick I figured out is stuff the deep well shaved socket with paper towels until the nut is settled just about half way down into it.

The stacks are up and torqued save one nut that's giving me a fit. Nothing will fit on it. I think they didn't indent the pipes quite enough right beside it. I'm going to wait until Ron get's back Monday and see if he has a rig for it. It's going to take a really skinny socket. I don't want to try and bend anything and break a stud or punch a hole in my new pipes...:mad2:

This picture is before I indexed the muffler to fit the cowl hole.




 
The flexible grabber tool worked great for starting the nuts.

Another trick I figured out is stuff the deep well shaved socket with paper towels until the nut is settled just about half way down into it.

The stacks are up and torqued save one nut that's giving me a fit. Nothing will fit on it. I think they didn't indent the pipes quite enough right beside it. I'm going to wait until Ron get's back Monday and see if he has a rig for it. It's going to take a really skinny socket. I don't want to try and bend anything and break a stud or punch a hole in my new pipes...:mad2:

This picture is before I indexed the muffler to fit the cowl hole.





Great looking exhaust...

I LOVE the way they do such a nice job with compound fishmouth joints..

VERY professional...:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:
 
Great looking exhaust...

I LOVE the way they do such a nice job with compound fishmouth joints..

VERY professional...:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:



How they weld it and it comes out to fit so tight and perfect I can't envision.

They must have it locked into a mold and bolted down during and after.

The welds look good. Knisley has some good welders. Maybe robotics? :dunno:
 
Got a dumb question ...

Why is there a heat riser going to just beneath the oil cooler? It's to cool the oil, so why run a heater duct to it? Constant temps?

Wouldn't it make sense to block it during hot weather?
 
Got a dumb question ...

Why is there a heat riser going to just beneath the oil cooler? It's to cool the oil, so why run a heater duct to it? Constant temps?

Wouldn't it make sense to block it during hot weather?

Isn't that the incoming supply air for cabin heat ???
 
The flexible grabber tool worked great for starting the nuts.

Another trick I figured out is stuff the deep well shaved socket with paper towels until the nut is settled just about half way down into it.

The stacks are up and torqued save one nut that's giving me a fit. Nothing will fit on it. I think they didn't indent the pipes quite enough right beside it. I'm going to wait until Ron get's back Monday and see if he has a rig for it. It's going to take a really skinny socket. I don't want to try and bend anything and break a stud or punch a hole in my new pipes...:mad2:

This picture is before I indexed the muffler to fit the cowl hole.

Try a crows foot socket or a 30°-60° offset open end, or maybe a modified crows foot custom wrench from a 7/16 box end. Grind out the section that is giving interference.
 
Isn't that the incoming supply air for cabin heat ???


Negative. The muffler cowl has two hoses coming off it, one to cabin heat, and one to a flange just below the oil cooler.

If you look at the picture, both hoses are off, but there is a 3" flange right below the oil cooler just behind the prop. One hose goes there. The other to the firewall heater valve.

You've got hot air being ducted just below the oil cooler all the time. :dunno:



 
Try a crows foot socket or a 30°-60° offset open end, or maybe a modified crows foot custom wrench from a 7/16 box end. Grind out the section that is giving interference.


thanks H. I'll give it try if Ron can't come up with something .... :yesnod:
 
Negative. The muffler cowl has two hoses coming off it, one to cabin heat, and one to a flange just below the oil cooler.

If you look at the picture, both hoses are off, but there is a 3" flange right below the oil cooler just behind the prop. One hose goes there. The other to the firewall heater valve.

You've got hot air being ducted just below the oil cooler all the time. :dunno:




Yeah..... That is the source air for cabin heat....
 
Yeah..... That is the source air for cabin heat....


No no ... look at the front of the engine. Just below the oil cooler in front of the #5 cylinder. See that big round flange?

The cabin heat flange is on the firewall. It's a box with a trap door. When not in use, the heat escapes out the side. The trap door opens when you pull the knob to cover the hole and let the heat into the cabin.
 
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No no ... look at the front of the engine. Just below the oil cooler. See that big round flange?

The cabin heat flange is on the firewall. It's a box with a trap door. When not in use, the heat escapes out the side. The trap door opens to cover the hole and let the heat into the cabin.

Whatever....:goofy::goofy::goofy:
 
It's a positive pressure air source to pressurize your shroud so air moves when you select cabin heat and in my plane, carb heat. If the shroud doesn't have positive pressure it won't move air when you open a heat gate.
 

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No no ... look at the front of the engine. Just below the oil cooler in front of the #5 cylinder. See that big round flange?

The cabin heat flange is on the firewall. It's a box with a trap door. When not in use, the heat escapes out the side. The trap door opens when you pull the knob to cover the hole and let the heat into the cabin.

I think he's trying to get you to duct the exhaust direct into the cabin, then come down and dump your body out of the plane and steal it.:lol:
 
Whatever....:goofy::goofy::goofy:


Here. I put a red circle around it. A 3" heater hose comes off the muffler cover to this flange. And it's open with no obstructions. It ducts hot air from around the muffler to just below the oil cooler.....

WTF? :dunno:


 
It's a positive pressure air source to pressurize your shroud so air moves when you select cabin heat and in my plane, carb heat. If the shroud doesn't have positive pressure it won't move air when you open a heat gate.



Thank you! Now that makes sense.

I wasn't thinking in terms of positive pressure.

I bet that makes the air coming out of the side of the cabin heat valve really hot when it's off, and it's dumping into your engine bay ....
 
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Here. I put a red circle around it. A 3" heater hose comes off the muffler cover to this flange. And it's open with no obstructions. It ducts hot air from around the muffler to just below the oil cooler.....

WTF? :dunno:




Sir.....

That is the SOURCE of high pressure air to be fed to the heat muff so you have cabin heat.....

You are visualizing the air going the wrong way.... IMHO...
 
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