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Old January 31st, 2009, 11:23 PM   #1
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Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

Our local TV stations are reporting on a SR-20 that crashed near Menomonie on a flight from Sheboygan to New Richmond. There was a fire/explosion on impact so I guess it's unlikely to be fuel exhaustion. Sounds like 3 on board with no survivors.
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Old February 2nd, 2009, 12:14 AM   #2
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

Quote:
Originally Posted by lancefisher View Post
Our local TV stations are reporting on a SR-20 that crashed near Menomonie on a flight from Sheboygan to New Richmond. There was a fire/explosion on impact so I guess it's unlikely to be fuel exhaustion. Sounds like 3 on board with no survivors.
More on that:

http://www.nbc15.com/home/headlines/38748657.html

Quote:
Witness Jackson McMahon of Menomonie told the Eau Claire Leader-Telegram that it looked like a big shooting star and he saw a "big pink glow" on the horizon.
A big shooting star? On fire before impact, maybe? I know how unreliable witnesses can be, but that's a new one.
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Old February 2nd, 2009, 11:44 AM   #3
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

What's the BRS look like at night when activated? I could imagine that looking like a "big shooting star"
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Old February 4th, 2009, 01:19 AM   #4
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Fair Winds and Clear Skies, My Friends......

Many of you might be aware that I found PoA due to the loss of a dear friend and fellow ski instr/PSIA examiner, John Lancaster (FlingWing), when his helicopter crashed in the GoM.

I was devastated to find out this morning that this crash was two more of my ski instr friends. Larry Berg and his wife Vicki Garves-Berg were both ski instrs and Examiners with the Central Division of PSIA.

Vicki was also a part time instr with me here in Vail. We spent many hrs talking flying in the locker room and over a few beers. Just this past Xmas holiday, Vicki and Larry were telling me that they had sold their previous aircraft and were so excited about taking delivery of an SR-20. They had only taken delivery of their SR-20 a few weeks ago.

The following is an announcement distributed by the PSIA-C office.

PSIA-C Examiners Vicki and Larry Berg Lost in Plane Crash
Long-time Alpine Education Staff examiners Vicki Garves-Berg and Larry Berg perished when their private plane crashed in western Wisconsin on Friday, January 30, at shortly after 9:40 p.m. Cause of the fatal tragedy is not known as of Monday morning.
Larry and Vicki both served as Central Division examiners for many years, provided clinic leadership for PSIA events, and delivered clinic and technical leadership for several snowsports schools in Wisconsin and Minnesota. In recent years Vicki was a leader in rejuvenating and expanding Central Division's "Train the Trainer" accreditation program. Both Vicki and Larry served on the Alpine Education and Certification Committee. Vicki also was an instructor for Vail.
Larry and Vicki took delivery of their Cirrus SR20 several weeks ago, with the engine completely rebuilt by the manufacturer. News media reported that Larry was "an experienced pilot", and had filed a routine instrument flight plan from Sheboygan, Wisconsin to their home base in New Richmond, Wisconsin. When their plane disappeared from radar screens their assigned flight level was 4,000 feet. Local witnesses, who feared the aircraft might hit a nearby home, reported that they saw plane lights but did not hear any motor noise. Reports from the scene describe a wooded area, flames, and debris strewn over an area roughly 150 feet wide and 400 feet long in Dunn County, north of Menomonie, Wisconsin.
A third passenger, 44 year old Brett Weller, from Hudson, Wisconsin, apparently rode along with Larry to Sheboygan. There they picked up Vicki. Larry often flew Vicki to and from her anesthetist service provided to hospitals throughout Wisconsin.
This tragic loss of Vicki and Larry is painful for hundreds of friends and colleagues in the community of snowsports instructors. PSIA/AASI Central extends condolences to Vicki and Larry's families and friends. "The Bergs" will be missed.


May you find fair winds and clear skies, my friends..... you will be missed!
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Old February 4th, 2009, 01:49 AM   #5
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

Very sorry to hear about your friends, Ric.
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Old February 4th, 2009, 08:27 AM   #6
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

I'm so sorry, Ric... very sad.

Blue skies, tailwinds...
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Old February 4th, 2009, 08:27 AM   #7
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

oh man, sorry to hear that ric
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Old February 4th, 2009, 12:05 PM   #8
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

I too am so sorry that you've lost more good friends to accidents. You may remember that I was one of John's local friends here in Minneapolis and still miss him. You have my deepest sympathy.
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Old February 4th, 2009, 12:19 PM   #9
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Re: Fair Winds and Clear Skies, My Friends......

Quote:
Originally Posted by colomtnflyer View Post
Many of you might be aware that I found PoA due to the loss of a dear friend and fellow ski instr/PSIA examiner, John Lancaster (FlingWing), when his helicopter crashed in the GoM.

I was devastated to find out this morning that this crash was two more of my ski instr friends. Larry Berg and his wife Vicki Garves-Berg were both ski instrs and Examiners with the Central Division of PSIA.

Vicki was also a part time instr with me here in Vail. We spent many hrs talking flying in the locker room and over a few beers. Just this past Xmas holiday, Vicki and Larry were telling me that they had sold their previous aircraft and were so excited about taking delivery of an SR-20. They had only taken delivery of their SR-20 a few weeks ago.

The following is an announcement distributed by the PSIA-C office.

PSIA-C Examiners Vicki and Larry Berg Lost in Plane Crash
Long-time Alpine Education Staff examiners Vicki Garves-Berg and Larry Berg perished when their private plane crashed in western Wisconsin on Friday, January 30, at shortly after 9:40 p.m. Cause of the fatal tragedy is not known as of Monday morning.
Larry and Vicki both served as Central Division examiners for many years, provided clinic leadership for PSIA events, and delivered clinic and technical leadership for several snowsports schools in Wisconsin and Minnesota. In recent years Vicki was a leader in rejuvenating and expanding Central Division's "Train the Trainer" accreditation program. Both Vicki and Larry served on the Alpine Education and Certification Committee. Vicki also was an instructor for Vail.
Larry and Vicki took delivery of their Cirrus SR20 several weeks ago, with the engine completely rebuilt by the manufacturer. News media reported that Larry was "an experienced pilot", and had filed a routine instrument flight plan from Sheboygan, Wisconsin to their home base in New Richmond, Wisconsin. When their plane disappeared from radar screens their assigned flight level was 4,000 feet. Local witnesses, who feared the aircraft might hit a nearby home, reported that they saw plane lights but did not hear any motor noise. Reports from the scene describe a wooded area, flames, and debris strewn over an area roughly 150 feet wide and 400 feet long in Dunn County, north of Menomonie, Wisconsin.
A third passenger, 44 year old Brett Weller, from Hudson, Wisconsin, apparently rode along with Larry to Sheboygan. There they picked up Vicki. Larry often flew Vicki to and from her anesthetist service provided to hospitals throughout Wisconsin.
This tragic loss of Vicki and Larry is painful for hundreds of friends and colleagues in the community of snowsports instructors. PSIA/AASI Central extends condolences to Vicki and Larry's families and friends. "The Bergs" will be missed.


May you find fair winds and clear skies, my friends..... you will be missed!
I'm so sorry Ric.
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Old February 4th, 2009, 01:07 PM   #10
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

I was attempting to obtain an analysis Skew-T plot for the area and time of the crash but I learned from Scott Dennstaedt (ScottD) that NOAA has quit archiving that data. In that conversation he also indicated that the accident may be ice related and that he's looking into that aspect of the incident with some potential that he'll publish what he learns. He did hint that ice might have indeed been a factor, possibly even SLD which can overwhelm even a FIKI airplane. So far all I could piece together is that the local weather was 900-1300 ft ceilings with good visibility (10nm) underneath and tops around 5000ft reported 60 miles west. Looking at the Flightaware track I see that the airplane changed altitudes a couple times during the flight which might indicate that they were attempting to stay out of clouds and icing. The track dropped off the radar soon after reaching 4000 ft. Keep in mind that this could be due to poor radar coverage in that area (I often get lost on radar a little further east below 6000 MSL) but I think the accident location is pretty close to where the radar lost track. AFaIK SR-20s don't have the TKS anti-ice the SR-22s come with, anyone know if that's true?
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Old February 4th, 2009, 03:26 PM   #11
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

Quote:
Originally Posted by lancefisher View Post
AFaIK SR-20s don't have the TKS anti-ice the SR-22s come with, anyone know if that's true?
Lance,

Yes. That's true.
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Old February 4th, 2009, 03:54 PM   #12
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

Quote:
Originally Posted by lancefisher View Post
I was attempting to obtain an analysis Skew-T plot for the area and time of the crash but I learned from Scott Dennstaedt (ScottD) that NOAA has quit archiving that data. In that conversation he also indicated that the accident may be ice related and that he's looking into that aspect of the incident with some potential that he'll publish what he learns. He did hint that ice might have indeed been a factor, possibly even SLD which can overwhelm even a FIKI airplane.
Lance,

Very unfortunate accident. Obviously, I don't know what caused the accident. May or may not have been weather related. We won't really know until the investigation is complete. So I won't speculate on the cause.

But I do know that the pilot was clearly headed toward conditions that were known (before departure) to have a high probability for icing in the first 6,000 feet. This was a case of an approaching warm front and warm air advection. Even though the temperature on the ground was -12C, the air aloft was warmer likely supporting supercooled liquid water. Moreover, the atmosphere aloft was getting warmer with time - this keeps the temperatures right in those perfect temps for structural icing.

I saved dozens of charts for this case and I managed to capture a few Skew-T diagrams. I won't post them all here, but I am going to develop a workshop, or at a minimum, a blog entry describing the weather at the time and location of the accident.

Here's one chart that represents the RAOB at MSP (MPX) valid at 00Z 31 Jan. This is about 60 nm west of the accident site and more than 4 hours prior to the accident. It is a bit upstream from the accident, so it is not a perfect match, but it is the best we have.



This is a classic non-convective SLD signature (FZDZ aloft) that I won't explain here. There wasn't FZDZ reported at the surface at MSP. If it was reaching the surface in spots, it is often reported as unknown precipitation (UP) since automated stations can't report FZDZ. The sounding analyses I looked at for the area were similar in structure, but lacked some details that are present in this structure above. This is typical of observed ( RAOB ) vs forecast ( model ) soundings.

Yes, there was an AIRMET active at the time of the accident (see below from the accident notification summary). This AIRMET was issued at 0245Z shortly after the pilot departed based on the time in the Flightaware track. However, there was an AIRMET active (see immediately below) for the accident location and destination prior to his departure (issued at 2045Z).

WAUS43 KKCI 302045
WA3Z
CHIZ WA 302045
AIRMET ZULU UPDT 3 FOR ICE AND FRZLVL VALID UNTIL 310300
.
AIRMET ICE...ND SD NE KS MN IA MO WI LS MI IL
FROM 30N INL TO YQT TO 50ESE YQT TO 20S ODI TO 20ESE IOW TO 40NE
FAM TO 50SSW COU TO 40ESE MCI TO 30WSW MCI TO 30NE OBH TO 40NE
ABR TO 80SE YWG TO 30N INL
MOD ICE BLW 080. CONDS CONTG BYD 03Z THRU 09Z.
.
OTLK VALID 0300-0900Z...ICE MN IA MO WI LM LS MI IL
BOUNDED BY 30N INL-YQT-80NE SAW-40SE SAW-60WSW TVC-30NNE BAE-40NE
FAM-50S COU-70SE OVR-60SSE RWF-20SW BRD-70WNW INL-30N INL
MOD ICE BLW 080. CONDS CONTG THRU 09Z.
.
FRZLVL...RANGING FROM SFC-090 ACRS AREA
MULT FRZLVL BLW 090 BOUNDED BY 60SSW YWG-30ESE GFK-40ENE ABR-
40N FSD-60S FSD-50ENE MCI-30SSE MCI-20NNW PWE-60ENE OBH-
70S BIS-70SW DIK-50NNW ISN-60SSW YWG
SFC ALG 50E AKO-20WNW MCK-70S OBH-40SSW PWE-20ENE SGF-60ENE
DYR
040 ALG 20SE SNY-60NW SLN-40SE OSW-20E RZC
....


Also, here's the accident notification summary from the NWS:

NOUS53 KMPX 310719
OAVMPX

FORENSIC SERVICES MANAGER (W/OM113)
NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE
C/O NOAA MESSAGE CENTER
SUITLAND, MARYLAND 20910

INFO: CENTRAL REGION HEADQUARTERS
W/CR1X3

ALPHA TAIL NUMBER: N495LV
AIRCRAFT TYPE: SR20

BRAVO 15 WEST OF EAU CLAIRE, WI 0340Z (940 PM CST)
FRIDAY JANUARY 30 2009.

CHARLIE 3 FATALITIES CONFIRMED.

DELTA METAR KLUM 310235Z AUTO 17003KT 10SM OVC017 M10/M16 A3000 RMK AO2

METAR KLUM 310255Z AUTO 15005KT 10SM OVC013 M10/M16 A3000 RMK AO2

ECHO KEAU 302327Z 3100/3124 22005KT P6SM SCT025 BKN070
FM310300 19006KT 6SM BR BKN015 OVC030
FM310800 19005KT 5SM BR OVC007 PROB30 3109/3112 3SM -FZDZ BR
OVC005
FM311800 20009KT P6SM SCT015 BKN030
FM312100 21010KT P6SM SCT030 BKN050=



FOXTROT 00Z JAN 31 KMPX RAOB (KTS)

SURFACE 22003
2000 MSL 24521
3000 MSL 28021

ESTIMATE FROM VWP AT KARX (KTS)
2000 MSL 24020
3000 MSL 27025



GOLF WA 310245
AIRMET SIERRA FOR IFR AND MTN OBSCN VALID UNTIL 310900.

AIRMET IFR...ND SD MN IA WI LM LS MI LH IL
FROM 60SW YWG TO 30N INL TO YQT TO 20ESE SSM TO 50NNW TVC TO
50SSW SAW TO 20NNE RHI TO 50NNE UIN TO 30SSW DSM TO 20N OVR TO
60ESE ABR TO 60SW YWG
CIG BLW 010/VIS BLW 3SM PCPN/BR. CONDS CONTG BYD 09Z THRU 15Z.


WA 310245
AIRMET TANGO FOR TURB VALID UNTIL 310900

AIRMET TURB...MN IA MO WI LM LS MI LH IL IN KY
FROM 30N INL TO YQT TO SSM TO YVV TO 30SE ECK TO FWA TO CVG TO HNN
TO HMV TO RZC TO OSW TO 20NNW SGF TO 30N INL
MOD TURB BTN FL220 AND FL410. CONDS CONTG BYD 09Z THRU 15Z.


WA 310245
AIRMET ZULU FOR ICE AND FRZLVL VALID UNTIL 310900

AIRMET ICE...MN IA MO WI LM IL IN KY AR TN
FROM 40NNE FSD TO 40SSE MSP TO 60ESE MCW TO 20E ORD TO FWA TO CVG
TO HNN TO HMV TO 20NE DYR TO 40NE BUM TO 40NNE FSD
MOD ICE BLW 080. CONDS CONTG BYD 09Z THRU 15Z.

AIRMET ICE...ND MN IA WI LM LS MI IL
FROM 50SW YWG TO 30N INL TO YQT TO 40NW SSM TO 20E ORD TO 60ESE
MCW TO 40SSE MSP TO 40NNE FSD TO 50SW YWG
MOD ICE BLW 140. CONDS CONTG BYD 09Z THRU 15Z.


HOTEL UNKNOWN
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Last edited by scottd; February 4th, 2009 at 04:15 PM.
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Old February 4th, 2009, 04:48 PM   #13
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

Ric, I'm sorry for your loss.
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Old February 4th, 2009, 07:23 PM   #14
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

Ric, I too am sorry for your loss. That just sucks.
Scott, I'm definitely going to have to sit down and look at this more carefully when I have some time.
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Old February 4th, 2009, 07:45 PM   #15
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

Condolences for your loss.
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Old February 5th, 2009, 08:01 PM   #16
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

The air traffic controller (ATC) asked the pilot if he was encountering any icing and the pilot replied, "negative."

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20090131X81912&key=1
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Old February 5th, 2009, 08:15 PM   #17
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

Hardly credible that "negative", givent the temp=dewpoint and the much lower slope than wet adaibatic air.....and capping at ~7000 feet.
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Old February 5th, 2009, 10:13 PM   #18
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

Quote:
Originally Posted by gkainz View Post
What's the BRS look like at night when activated? I could imagine that looking like a "big shooting star"
Apparently not...

Quote:
The Cirrus Airframe Parachute System (CAPS) parachute was found deployed in the wreckage path about 120 feet from the initial point of impact. The red colored CAPS activation handle, handle holder, and activation cable were found separated from the fuselage. The CAPS safety pin with the red colored "Remove Before Flight" tag was found in the activation handle still in the handle holder. According to the Cirrus Pilot's Operating Handbook, the preflight checklist calls for the CAPS safety pin to be removed prior to flight.
So, the chute wasn't pulled. Sounds like it may have cooked off though.
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Old February 5th, 2009, 10:26 PM   #19
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

Quote:
Originally Posted by scottd View Post
The air traffic controller (ATC) asked the pilot if he was encountering any icing and the pilot replied, "negative."

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20090131X81912&key=1
The URL under your link is bogus, the display link text (below) works OK.

www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20090131X81912&key=1

And in the NTSB prelim, it's hard to tell when the pilot reported negative to ice. It could easily be that the report came before he got low enough to be in the clouds.
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Last edited by gismo; February 5th, 2009 at 10:28 PM.
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Old February 6th, 2009, 07:10 AM   #20
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Re: Cirrus SR-20 crash in western WI last night

Quote:
Originally Posted by lancefisher View Post
The URL under your link is bogus, the display link text (below) works OK.

http:www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20090131X81912&key=1
Lance,

Works fine for me?
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Old February 6th, 2009, 12:19 PM   #21
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Re: Fair Winds and Clear Skies, My Friends......

Quote:
Originally Posted by colomtnflyer View Post
Many of you might be aware that I found PoA due to the loss of a dear friend and fellow ski instr/PSIA examiner, John Lancaster (FlingWing), when his helicopter crashed in the GoM.

I was devastated to find out this morning that this crash was two more of my ski instr friends. Larry Berg and his wife Vicki Garves-Berg were both ski instrs and Examiners with the Central Division of PSIA.

Vicki was also a part time instr with me here in Vail. We spent many hrs talking flying in the locker room and over a few beers. Just this past Xmas holiday, Vicki and Larry were telling me that they had sold their previous aircraft and were so excited about taking delivery of an SR-20. They had only taken delivery of their SR-20 a few weeks ago.

The following is an announcement distributed by the PSIA-C office.

PSIA-C Examiners Vicki and Larry Berg Lost in Plane Crash
Long-time Alpine Education Staff examiners Vicki Garves-Berg and Larry Berg perished when their private plane crashed in western Wisconsin on Friday, January 30, at shortly after 9:40 p.m. Cause of the fatal tragedy is not known as of Monday morning.
Larry and Vicki both served as Central Division examiners for many years, provided clinic leadership for PSIA events, and delivered clinic and technical leadership for several snowsports schools in Wisconsin and Minnesota. In recent years Vicki was a leader in rejuvenating and expanding Central Division's "Train the Trainer" accreditation program. Both Vicki and Larry served on the Alpine Education and Certification Committee. Vicki also was an instructor for Vail.
Larry and Vicki took delivery of their Cirrus SR20 several weeks ago, with the engine completely rebuilt by the manufacturer. News media reported that Larry was "an experienced pilot", and had filed a routine instrument flight plan from Sheboygan, Wisconsin to their home base in New Richmond, Wisconsin. When their plane disappeared from radar screens their assigned flight level was 4,000 feet. Local witnesses, who feared the aircraft might hit a nearby home, reported that they saw plane lights but did not hear any motor noise. Reports from the scene describe a wooded area, flames, and debris strewn over an area roughly 150 feet wide and 400 feet long in Dunn County, north of Menomonie, Wisconsin.
A third passenger, 44 year old Brett Weller, from Hudson, Wisconsin, apparently rode along with Larry to Sheboygan. There they picked up Vicki. Larry often flew Vicki to and from her anesthetist service provided to hospitals throughout Wisconsin.
This tragic loss of Vicki and Larry is painful for hundreds of friends and colleagues in the community of snowsports instructors. PSIA/AASI Central extends condolences to Vicki and Larry's families and friends. "The Bergs" will be missed.


May you find fair winds and clear skies, my friends..... you will be missed!
My condolences as well....
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